16 replies to this topic

[DarrylB]

A mate of mine has been talking to Tesla for a while now and has been helping them out on a few odds and ends, anyway, they let him have a car for a week:

Outside the Tesla Store in London @ 5pm


9am the following morning - he found himself here:


And yes, I did question him on why the roof was still on it! He said that at 9am it wasn't actually that warm.....poor excuse I say! lol

Link to the full album

He's coming over my way on Friday so I should hopefully get some nice pics! (and may be a go!)

[forgotmepassword]

Cool

[R20BY_M]

Very cool car - I see one in the flesh at the 2008 motorshow, couldn't tell if the engine was on or not I like the fact that its a real, fast sports car (although know nothing about the handling and how batteries affect it) that's got a faster 0-60 than a Lambo and yet has a decent range, something they haven't perfected in the family car market yet. Just a shame the price is so high Their other models look suitably good too. I hear they are now joining up with Toyota, which should make the technology (read carbon fibre lightweight panels - the expensive bits) more mainstream.

[DarrylB]

Well he popped over early this morning! It's not often that we get a £130,000 car on the driveway!

I'll let the pics do the talking! I had a drive in it! AMAZING!

Edited by DarrylB, 04 June 2010 - 03:20 PM.

[DarrylB]

Edit: just trying to sort bigger res pics!

Edited by DarrylB, 04 June 2010 - 02:56 PM.

[rcvaughan]

Fantastic! But your driveway looks like it frequently has £130,000 cars parked on it! It it bad of me to say I'd swap my VX for one?

[DarrylB]

But your driveway looks like it frequently has £130,000 cars parked on it!

Pah! I wish! the only other car to grace the driveway that was over a 100k was James Bonds actual AM Vanquish from the first film that it was in

The Tesla was great to drive - I'll post a proper report when I get a sec

[rcvaughan]

Think I may have mistaken your 'driveway' for the grounds of the hotel looking thing! Look forward to the write up

Edited by rcvaughan, 04 June 2010 - 03:20 PM.

[Phear]

Fantastic!

But your driveway looks like it frequently has £130,000 cars parked on it!

It it bad of me to say I'd swap my VX for one?

You aren't the only one, although I know the weight means it won't handle like a VX, that instant torque would be fantastic and I actually afford to drive the damn thing every day!

[DarrylB]

Photobucket is being a bugger with the re-sizing.

Better sized pics here: http://picasaweb.goo...ell/TeslaVX220#

[Steve B]

So how did it drive?

[Mangham54]

So how did it drive?

Wow, I knew there would be some minor styling crossovers with the S1/S2 and VX... But to have our steeing wheel

£100k is extreme, but given the potential for technological advances due in the next year or so then the prices will hopefully come down. Also did it have any solar panels on it to assist with casual recharging?

[chrisvx220]

Looks in mat black

[Cookies220]

Given that hydrogen fuel cells seem to be a much better way of producing an electric motor, I wouldn't be surprised if the Tesla died out before it really got going. Great looking, and fast too - but the recharge time is so impractical it just isn't viable.

[dpeilow]

Hi,

I'm Darryl's friend that blagged the Tesla. (To be clear, I definitely don't work for them but I have stayed in touch since I spoke with them at Goodwood FoS two years ago, hence the loan.)

The car is a right laugh to drive. I don't think I'd ever get bored of the silly torque off the line or at any vaguely legal speed. The overtaking is ruthless. Sure you feel the weight in the back, but it still handles better than 95% of everything else out there If I had the £80k I'd get one like a shot. As it is, I'll have to wait for prices to reach something sensible or rob a bank instead.

We've been at Le Mans this past week, so hopefully Darryl will give you his thoughts soon. Safe to say he liked it.



So to address a couple of points:

Given that hydrogen fuel cells seem to be a much better way of producing an electric motor

What do you mean by better? Fuel Cell vehicles work for sure, but the amount of precious metals used in them means the cell is worth hundreds of thousands. The reality is that Honda's FCXs cost well over a million dollars each.

But even assuming that drops in price (if they can remove the expensive catalysts in the cells), the real issue is the infrastructure and making the hydrogen economically. They never tell you it takes 20 minutes to fill the car due to the pressures involved in the tank; the stations that make hydrogen on site can only refuel 15 cars a day and so much energy is wasted in the whole process that you might as well keep burning petrol.

Don't believe me? Flick through this, this and this from the European Fuel Cell Forum. Yes, even the fuel cell people can't stick their heads in the sand on this one. See attached image below for the crux of the problem: 23% efficiency is not good.

James May seems to leave that stuff out of his reports, funnily enough.

Great looking, and fast too - but the recharge time is so impractical it just isn't viable.

I did 772 miles in just over two days. I crossed the country from east to west and back and fitted it into the same journey that I normally do (for work) when visiting that site in my own car, so I have to disagree...


But mine could be construed as a special case, so what would be practical - something you could drive all day without filling up? Something you could recharge in 10 minutes? A mix of both?

How about 300 miles with a 45 minute fill up? Or a fill up in 10 minutes (it's been done, see slide 12)?

Besides, the Tesla Roadster currently has 2008 state-of-the-art cells, but the best ones Panasonic now have would take it well over 300 miles. I'd say after driving 300 miles you'd probably want to stop for something to eat and to stretch your legs. Fill the car then.


Hydrogen infrastructure was, is and always will be 20 years away. They might roll out a couple of pumps for the Olympics or at some university campus, but that is about it. We've all got the Tesla's infrastructure at home already and I found it no problem to plug into double sockets (as a minimum) and keep the car topped up. For longer journeys, installing 250kW 10 minute chargers at motorway services will be a fraction of the price of cryogenic storage tanks and can be done by EDF / Southern Electric / etc next week. It's bread and butter stuff for them.

Besides, given the choice between a slightly podgy but Lambo-beating cousin of a Lotus or a lethargic (100bhp) Prius clone, I know what I'd rather have.

Attached Files

•  H2-E.JPG   64.31KB   1 downloads

Edited by dpeilow, 18 June 2010 - 11:14 AM.

[DarrylB]

Cheers for this Dave! Only just seen it!

[Ferrite]

Hi,

I'm Darryl's friend that blagged the Tesla. (To be clear, I definitely don't work for them but I have stayed in touch since I spoke with them at Goodwood FoS two years ago, hence the loan.)

The car is a right laugh to drive. I don't think I'd ever get bored of the silly torque off the line or at any vaguely legal speed. The overtaking is ruthless. Sure you feel the weight in the back, but it still handles better than 95% of everything else out there If I had the £80k I'd get one like a shot. As it is, I'll have to wait for prices to reach something sensible or rob a bank instead.

We've been at Le Mans this past week, so hopefully Darryl will give you his thoughts soon. Safe to say he liked it.



So to address a couple of points:

Given that hydrogen fuel cells seem to be a much better way of producing an electric motor

What do you mean by better? Fuel Cell vehicles work for sure, but the amount of precious metals used in them means the cell is worth hundreds of thousands. The reality is that Honda's FCXs cost well over a million dollars each.

But even assuming that drops in price (if they can remove the expensive catalysts in the cells), the real issue is the infrastructure and making the hydrogen economically. They never tell you it takes 20 minutes to fill the car due to the pressures involved in the tank; the stations that make hydrogen on site can only refuel 15 cars a day and so much energy is wasted in the whole process that you might as well keep burning petrol.

Don't believe me? Flick through this, this and this from the European Fuel Cell Forum. Yes, even the fuel cell people can't stick their heads in the sand on this one. See attached image below for the crux of the problem: 23% efficiency is not good.

James May seems to leave that stuff out of his reports, funnily enough.

Great looking, and fast too - but the recharge time is so impractical it just isn't viable.

I did 772 miles in just over two days. I crossed the country from east to west and back and fitted it into the same journey that I normally do (for work) when visiting that site in my own car, so I have to disagree...


But mine could be construed as a special case, so what would be practical - something you could drive all day without filling up? Something you could recharge in 10 minutes? A mix of both?

How about 300 miles with a 45 minute fill up? Or a fill up in 10 minutes (it's been done, see slide 12)?

Besides, the Tesla Roadster currently has 2008 state-of-the-art cells, but the best ones Panasonic now have would take it well over 300 miles. I'd say after driving 300 miles you'd probably want to stop for something to eat and to stretch your legs. Fill the car then.


Hydrogen infrastructure was, is and always will be 20 years away. They might roll out a couple of pumps for the Olympics or at some university campus, but that is about it. We've all got the Tesla's infrastructure at home already and I found it no problem to plug into double sockets (as a minimum) and keep the car topped up. For longer journeys, installing 250kW 10 minute chargers at motorway services will be a fraction of the price of cryogenic storage tanks and can be done by EDF / Southern Electric / etc next week. It's bread and butter stuff for them.

Besides, given the choice between a slightly podgy but Lambo-beating cousin of a Lotus or a lethargic (100bhp) Prius clone, I know what I'd rather have.

Thanks for the super clear breakdown there. I was going to try to explain all the same things, but luckily you did it in FAR better language than I could have managed!

Electricity is a cheap, easy to manufacture commodity, particularly once nuclear fusion becomes viable. In the timescales we are talking about here both look set to arrive pretty simultaneously, though I'd imagine fusion will take another 50 years to become properly productive due to set-up costs etc.

It's a great looking beast though! Would love to get to try one!

My only question is how many expensive/incredibly unsustainable metals are used in the batteries for the Tesla? That to me is its biggest problem.

What Toyota don't tell you about the eco-friendly Prius (questionable anyway IMHO) is the damage done to the environment to manufacture the thing. One wonders if this is a similar case?