120 replies to this topic

[LY_Scott]

dealer history for the car ? - doesnt the kerridge system keep track of anything done to a vehicle ? (it did at iveco)

timing chain takes about an hour when the engines out

hehe kerridge. I remember that from when I worked at a VW/Audi dealership. nice. and yes it does.

what was the older motor trade system? kalamazoo or some stupid name?

[slindborg]

granted im a fairly competant amature spanner monkey but as said even I managed it in 8 SLOW hours.......

[JG]

Cam chain should not take 11.5 hours. When vauxhall did mine i think they said it took them 5.

[luna_s]

closeup


yeah dont remind me about kerridge

[n1k_ns]

My Dad worked for Kalamazoo and Kerridge

Update from Vauxhall:

Hi Nick,

Your enquiry as been passed to myself to deal with, as per VX220 - N1 KNS (KY02 NHV).

I would like to arrange inspection of your vehicle to establish “an intermittent ticking sound on cold startup”

re your e-mail. The vehicle will need to be left overnight to experience this problem you describe.

We have two VX220 specialist technicians, checking there holiday arrangements we feel week beginning 13/08/2007 is available.

Please make contact with myself to discuss this matter.

I have decided to take the car to TMS to have a look at it as ive got afew things that need sorting as well, so ill see what they reckon.

[pugwhizz]

well, after hearing the 'exhaust manifold' ticking story i decided to check it out. started car up this morning with engine bay open and had a nosey. to my suprise i saw a few small wisps of exhaust condensation coming from the manifold area. maybe this IS the cause of the ticking afterall. if it is, i'll be bowled over as the noise made bears no resemblence to how i would imagine... on the plus side, it might not be a chain/tappet related noise after all... we shall see...

[Stefan_A]

Anyone who has the part no of the timing chain kit? Checked out autovaux briefly but couldn't even find VX220 at their site

[luna_s]

Use the parts enquiry form, or email their sales dept, Timing Chain Kit = 12577385 £93 +VAT Crank Seal = 90571925 £11.40 +VAT Timing Cover Gasket = 24435052 £7.40 +VAT Cam Cover Gasket = 12584084 £18.10 +VAT Balance Shaft Chain Kit = 12576647 £87.50 +VAT Crank Bolt = 11589123 £2.76 +VAT Oil Filter = 93175493 £3.72 +VAT

[Thorney]

Sorry, I looked into this yesterday. Firstly I've never seen a camchain go on a VX220, we've serviced hundreds and never even seen any slight issues with them at all. On all the race cars whenever the engines have been out we've insepcted the chains, guides etc and never seen anything like premature wear. It was for this reason that I asked kerry to put 11 hours on the job - simply put unless you have difinitive problem then it is a waste of money getting us (or anyone else) to inspect/replace it - I was trying save them money. Sometimes this forum rather than save people money just goes out to scare the crap out of people, then they ring us and I have to calm them down, so again, in short, we've NEVER had to even inspect a timing chain fault/issue EVER. This doesn't mean to say that they can never have problems - that would be peurile but when someone rings up asking that its inspected as they're worried about after reading about the 'big problem' here I've got to do something. The total job (depending on how we do it) would be about 6 hours of labour. The camchain kit parts are about £150 as well, but you really, really do not need to even think about this unless you have a loud noise which reacts with engine RPM, little ticking noises do not count. Also, there is no Vauxhall recall on this, there's not even a field note, I've made every enquiry I can and no-one at vauxhall has even heard of anything like this on the VX220, ever. I probably shouldnt have told kerry to price it up to stop people coming, but I dont want to spend peoples money on cars when it really isn't needed, they're expensive enough as it is. However, if I'm going to get a kicking for this then fine, bring em all down, we'll charge 6 hours plus parts to inspect a part which is perfectly fine and just send you on your way a little bit poorer - that better?

[luna_s]

they snap, its a fact, its a known issue with a revised oil jet, and even vauxhall released a field remedy in case of customer complaint, there is reason to "scare" , i was stranded in the cold for 3 hours when mine went, i'd hate to see something worse happen, plus the costs and stress caused when the thing does go to other people. mine went without any warning at all its a problem vauxhall shouldve done free of charge, i still have evidence of the blocked jet and to say it just wont happen is silly. Field Remedy: 1532 Subject: Engine Z22SE - Broken Timing Chain Models: Engines: Option: Astra-G 2000...2002,VX220 2000...2002,Speedster 2000...2002,Zafira 2000...2002,Vectra-B 2000...2001 Z22SE,Z22SE,Z22SE,Z22SE,Z22SE Complaint: Engine damaged by broken timing chain. Cause: Missing or unsufficient lubrication of the timing chain. Production: Modified timing chain and lubrication nozzle have been introduced in production as of the following engine-No: 11065400 (March 2002). probably havent heard anything cos they chose to just ignore me imo it should've been a recall, but obviously costing so much to fix theyd rather bury it or maybe my snapped chain and mashed valves and blocked jet was a figment of my imagination

Edited by luna_s, 25 August 2007 - 06:23 AM.

[luna_s]

oh look its a not snapped timing chain in a vx220, i guess its supposed to look like that

Edited by luna_s, 25 August 2007 - 06:34 AM.

[SamVx]

But didn't yours go about about 90k? I thought you had to replace the chain at 100? Although that still means yours broke as opposed to wore out - but at least it wasn't at 40k. Cheers for that Thorney - I think you will have probably put a lot of people at ease.

[luna_s]

i'm not answering any more timing chain related issues, i'm obviously clearly wrong

[Thorney]

Will you actually read my post? I'm not saying they will never snap, I'm not saying yours didn't snap, I'm just saying the incidence of these things going wrong is very very very small and people shouldn't panic. The field notice you keep referring to is an engine one not a model one, it reflects data recieved by Vauxhall for the 2.2 engine fitted to other models where timing chains are known to have a greater incidence of snapping (Astras and Zafira) but as the same engine is also fitted to the VX220 that model is included. I'm just trying to calm down the people who have read this and think they're all on time bombs when that is NOT the case thats all. Put it this way, we had one booked in a few weeks ago specifically for a timing chain replacement and 40k service, when he turned up we looked at it and said it was fine and asked why he'd brought it in and he said that he'd 'heard' the chains all break at 40k and wanted it replaced as a precaution. I'm all for keeping people aware but sheer scaremongering is exactly that.

[slindborg]

Agreed that they arent time bonbs BUT the chain isnt indestructable and if it wasnt a problem why did GM update the chain and tentioner kit twice? Mine had the smaller oil jet, the older tensioner and some random old chain in there..... also the engine number fell into the feild remedy note so that implies it was down to GM to fix for free but they werent havning any of it as they are just prize cnuts and feed the twaddle down to their dealers to brain wash them with too. also look on z22se.co.uk there are a fair few having to get chains done due to slapping/banging from the chain but then since they are mainly in astras and vectras that has nothing to do with the same engine in the vx lol as said little rattles arent an issue as such its big slappy/thunking noises that you need to be aware of (kinda wish i recorded mine now but didnt want to run the engine for longer than nessecary) Much like with cambelts, if you ever get the chance to do any work where the chain is removed then change it for the updated version from autovaux (far cheaper than gm, but call them since email is vauge too unless your a known customer)

[luna_s]

just me trying to look after other peoples best interests, remedy before the disease, 700 quid is cheaper than 2k + for an engine and the inconvenience for the record, mine didnt make any noise oh well

[Thorney]

Again, I'm not trying to stop anyone sharing things that have happened and acting as a warning to others, all I am trying to do is inject some perspective into it thats all. The cam chain is something I personally think people should keep an ear out for but its not something I lie awake at night worrying about, you have to remember that there are a vast amount of people who just read this forum and don't post and take some comments as verbatim so people do need to see the issue in a reasonable light. When have someone turn up saying "oh I hear cam chains break at 40k, might as well replace it at the same time as the service" thus smacking themself with a £500 bill (if we did the work, which we declined) when they don't need to then what would you do?

[vocky]

I go with the facts.... fact one: if your engine number is below 11064500 it was fitted with the smaller oil jet, normally 52 plate and above have the later spec chain kit. fact two: the smaller oil jet can block and cause the chain to snap. fact three: a service interval of 20,000 miles is bad for any engine, for some reason the chain usually breaks after the second 40,000 mile service (the most common mileage is 41,000 miles for some weird reason). fact four: vx220's tend to get over serviced - so the oil jet is less likely to block. fact five: a rattle on cold start up usually means there is a problem with the chain. I've personally had to inform people not to even start their engine and have their car towed to the garage, one guy thought he would have another listen so started it and yes it snapped It's the downside for being the tech mod on z22se, I am usually the bearer of the bad news and it does get to me, people who can little afford a new chain end up paying for a new engine. I have received many thank you's from people who followed my advice. They saw the broken pieces of chain guide etc, and realised how lucky they were. So it's not something to lose sleep over, but you need to be aware it can happen. My advice, change the oil and filter every 5,000 miles and stop worrying. If you hear a rattle on cold start up get the chain replaced.

[Winstar]

But didn't yours go about about 90k? I thought you had to replace the chain at 100? Although that still means yours broke as opposed to wore out - but at least it wasn't at 40k.
Cheers for that Thorney - I think you will have probably put a lot of people at ease.

No the cam chain is supposed to last the life of the engine, and will as long as it get sufficient oil.

[Richy]

But didn't yours go about about 90k? I thought you had to replace the chain at 100? Although that still means yours broke as opposed to wore out - but at least it wasn't at 40k.
Cheers for that Thorney - I think you will have probably put a lot of people at ease.

No the cam chain is supposed to last the life of the engine, and will as long as it get sufficient oil.

Indeed it should

The fact is, if your oil is checked and changed regulary - the jet will not block up and starve chain of oil.

ASK JT how many cars were running with less than half the oil they should have in them at the 05 national, im sure he's seen alot more cars with only 2-3ltres in them since starting ThorneyMotorsport.

My VX drinks oil - and so do alot of others on here - hence me checking it everyweek and changing it every 4-5k without fail.. it comes out sometimes as clean as it goes in

I bet theres owners on here that don't even check the oil, and only service it when the book says so