13 replies to this topic

[vx220bass]

Hi, Originally intended to pick up a stage 2 tuned turbo but ended up buying a well looked after low mileage one running on standard map. I can currently feel a drop in acceleration around 3000-4000rpm which I have read is to do with the original map and Vauxhall trying to meet emissions. Have read that remap cars drive much better. Looking to spend about 6 months getting used to the car (including a couple of track days) and then get it remapped. So following discussion with my insurance company CCI they won't up my policy until I exceed 250bhp which fits nicely with a stage tune. My question is what do you best recommend to ensure when I take it for it remap that that I get as much of those 250bhp and as much torque as possiible. I have listed my car spec below with my thoughts/understanding (from searching and reading around etc) but some specific advice would be great Turbo running standard map - Remap to stage 2 Exhaust - Already has Miltek precat decat and Miltek back box - Get 200 cell sports cat Engine - Has shortened auxilary drive belt and other pulleys removed (think this is the same as underdriven pulley mod) - Considered balancer shaft deletion but not sure how hard it is? Brake - Uprated standard size discs and Mintex pad plus 5.1 fluid Suspension - Standard - would like to leave this way for ride comfort Wheels - 16/17 TD's with T1R's all-round (when take winters back off..) My aim is to get good power and torque from it, but figures aren't everything want to get good useable power Advice appreciated Julian

[snotvomit]

I had mine remapped at MMG and Liam got rid of the flat spot. It makes a big difference if stuff like that bothers you (it really bothered me). I would recommend Toyo R1R's rather than T1R's (others may disagree). Get the remap done before track day - if the flat spot bothers you now, you'll really hate it on the track.

[chrisgold]

Hi,

Originally intended to pick up a stage 2 tuned turbo but ended up buying a well looked after low mileage one running on standard map.

I can currently feel a drop in acceleration around 3000-4000rpm which I have read is to do with the original map and Vauxhall trying to meet emissions. Have read that remap cars drive much better.

Looking to spend about 6 months getting used to the car (including a couple of track days) and then get it remapped. So following discussion with my insurance company CCI they won't up my policy until I exceed 250bhp which fits nicely with a stage tune.

My question is what do you best recommend to ensure when I take it for it remap that that I get as much of those 250bhp and as much torque as possiible.

I have listed my car spec below with my thoughts/understanding (from searching and reading around etc) but some specific advice would be great

Turbo running standard map - Remap to stage 2

Exhaust - Already has Miltek precat decat and Miltek back box - Get 200 cell sports cat

Engine - Has shortened auxilary drive belt and other pulleys removed (think this is the same as underdriven pulley mod)
- Considered balancer shaft deletion but not sure how hard it is?

Brake - Uprated standard size discs and Mintex pad plus 5.1 fluid

Suspension - Standard - would like to leave this way for ride comfort

Wheels - 16/17 TD's with T1R's all-round (when take winters back off..)

My aim is to get good power and torque from it, but figures aren't everything want to get good useable power

Advice appreciated

Julian

I would not bother with the balancer shaft deletion for stage 2

Your standard disks will be fine, unless they are old, then replace them, I have the EBC ultimax, they are better, but its not a huge difference, Dont bother with 5.1 as you will have to change it every year, just get the ATE Superblue dot 4.0, its amazing!

http://www.ebay.co.u...57#ht_584wt_952

Yeh, go and see Liam over at MMG, Im sure he would mod/sort your current exhaust so its suitable for stage 2 power, as his stage 2 exhaust is a 3" system, but you dont have to buy it, My stage 2 was 263bhp and 275lbft, You could always stick the MMG upgraded Intercooler in it also, will help a lot if your tracking it, stage 3 I had about 3 less bhp, but about +30 lbft and it was a lot quicker! And then you already have the intercooler if you want to go stage 4 at a later date.

As far as tyres go, for the money the Yokohama AD08 is the best tyre for the money atm, its a costs little more than a T1R, but is a just as good if not better than an R1R, but a lot cheaper!

[rob999]

Remap from CMS or MMG. Job done.

[vx220bass]

Forgot to say also has uprated high pressure alloy rad from elise-shop and courtney sport air filter and I believe airbox mod So what had you done to get those figures from a stage 2 as I thought 240-250 was expected? Is my exhaust being only 2.25"/2.5" not sure what the milltek is going to be a restriction for me then? Not looking to be tracking it a lot only up to the 5 that CCI cover a yea,r most of its driving will be road use although it is not currently used everyday as I walk to work Rob999: Do you not think I need to do anything to the exhaust if it has the standard cat?

Edited by vx220bass, 21 December 2011 - 06:31 PM.

[G-Bob]

Did Spuk not get about 245bhp from an MMG remap and a de-cat pipe? I think MMG call is a stage 1+ but I think most people get around 235bhp from that.

[chrisgold]

Did Spuk not get about 245bhp from an MMG remap and a de-cat pipe?
I think MMG call is a stage 1+ but I think most people get around 235bhp from that.

Yeh, good bhp from a MMG stage 1, just not much torque...

Forgot to say also has uprated high pressure alloy rad from elise-shop and courtney sport air filter and I believe airbox mod

So what had you done to get those figures from a stage 2 as I thought 240-250 was expected? Is my exhaust being only 2.25"/2.5" not sure what the milltek is going to be a restriction for me then?

Not looking to be tracking it a lot only up to the 5 that CCI cover a yea,r most of its driving will be road use although it is not currently used everyday as I walk to work

Rob999: Do you not think I need to do anything to the exhaust if it has the standard cat?

5 is still a good few track days lol......

You can have a standard stage 2 map 240-250bhp, or you can ask for the stage2+ map if he is happy your car will take it and you want a bit more power........ I wanted Power! lol Mine was pretty much standard stage 2, plugs, air box mod, I had a few other bits, uprated pro alloy rad, pipercross induction, uprated recirculating valve, uprated pipework, cool running thermostat, engine and gearbox breathers, uprated clutch, probs other little bits like that, that dont add any power, so nothing rly...... oh dont bother with an induction, you will kill your MAF!

With the exhaust you could just get a centre section put in with decat, so run without a cat at all and put it back in for MOT, when you get this done you could also put larger diameter sections put in and try and take out some bends etc, just modding what you already have as you have the milltek back box already.

However, if you plan going to stage 4 one day, you may be better off just splashing out on a 3" system now and selling your Milltek?

Edited by chrisgold, 21 December 2011 - 07:16 PM.

[rob999]

Si aka Spuk got about 245 from a pre cat removal and a map so I don't see why you couldn't get around 245-250bhp via MMG.

[spuk87]

Yeah on my first map I had 243bhp but then on an updated map dropped slightly to 241bhp and 268lb ft of torque, just shy of a modern stage 2 and on par with older stage 2 maps. As said that was with just precat removed. With your current hardware you should probably get over 250bhp with an MMG map (not sure of courtenays) - don't forget that the dyno result you get however is not solid proof of your power; if you tell CCI it has 249bhp how would they be able to prove it has or hasn't got that? With regard to drivability I find mine is great though I have never driven any VX mapped by another tuner to compare. Pickup at low revs is great for lazy overtaking. Liam at MMG drove it recently and was surprised how fast it felt, even though he mapped it

[siztenboots]

you should remove the balancers on any z20let , standard or modified. this alone signicantly improves the engine character and fuel economy. don't go above 250 lbft of torque or you will need an expensive clutch upgrade. plus the original turbo won't last long at much higher boost don't change the thermostat as its known cause of fouled plugs , damaged cats and lambda sensors, plus poor fuel economy. buy the best fully synth oil you can when its on discount, and try and change it often. I'd recommend Gulf competition racing 10w60 for hard track use , 5 litres around £35 from opieoils.co.uk

[spuk87]

you should remove the balancers on any z20let , standard or modified. this alone signicantly improves the engine character and fuel economy.

I knew about the improved rev response but didn't think about fuel economy. What sort of % improvement do you get?

[siztenboots]

note that the balancer shafts run at double engine rpm speed and the mass is eccentric, this parasitic loss isn't beneficial like a flywheel. in the pursuit of emissions, the trend is replacing parasitic loads, power steering, ancilliary pumps, with electrically driven in the pursuit of less CO2. Merc now have very low friction balancers shafts that save 1% compared to previous. to put a figure, I say around 5bhp, probably more at higher rpm

[vx220bass]

Hi thanks for the advice, if I don't want to have to swap a main decat for each mot would you recommend a 200 cell sports cat or will there not be major difference? have heard 100 cell cats can have problems passing mot's and know 200 cell can be around £500 so want to know its worth it before the outlay, would hope it would give a nice sound too if I'm honest as miltek is a bit quiet at the moment, but probably good for track noise limits. So is it possible to have it remapped to restrict the torque to 250lbft but still achieve 250 bhp/good power? Would prefer to avoid expensive clutch upgrades but still want the best I can get from the car Is there anywhere that will do the balancer deletion for me, if so any ideas on cost? or should I be able to do this myself? (i'm not totally incompetent with a car just not used to working what appears to be inside the engine) I'm assuming that this isn't something that would affect the mapping so could be done before or after with no disadvantages?

[siztenboots]

If you are dropping the exhaust, then its good to combine both jobs , and put in new oil. If in doubt call Mark or Jon at Courtenay Sport, full instructions in the kit. The Astra VXR engine has these removed at the factory. No reason at all why you could not map the requested torque to be 250 lbft from 2500 rpm through to 5252 rpm (250bhp exactly) , its just that most maps are developed for the heavier cars and they want the "sport button" throttle response, whereas a nice linear throttle map is better on a car that weighs half as much.