16 replies to this topic

[Aerodynamic]

Hi I bouoght a new instrument "lable" so I could change the speedometer scale from MPH to KMH, this was so I could register my car in sweden. Anyway I am not entirely happy with this and I want it back to original, but it is not easy to find original speedster cluster with kmh scale. But I want the scale also to show 8000rpm on the tachometer and saw there are lotus elise display looking almost exactly the same as speedster once, does anyone knows if this fits directly into a speedster? I´m going to change to a Honda engin, I got a wireing scheme on how to install Honda engin into Elise s2, anyone knows if this can be used to install a Honda engin into a Speedster or is it completely different elecric wirings. Thank you in advance. BR, Per

[alanoo]

Completely different

[Gilgamesh]

my car is registred with the MPH speedometer here in Sweden, it shows both so should not be any problem.

[Aerodynamic]

My car is already registrated in sweden so I don´t need it anymore, but I don´t think I can remove the lable without dfamaging the original one. I also want a 8k rpm scale, and if I can use a lotus one that seems to be identical fysically then I could more easely get a kmph scale. It´smuch easier to get a lotus cluster then a Speedster cluster. Anyone tried to fit a lotus cluster into a speedster? BR, Per

[techieboy]

Vocky has used parts of the S1 Elise cluster in a genuine NA STACK cluster to give a higher rpm scale for the ITB'd cars. Not sure if that's possible with the fake turbo STACK though, as that also has an extra plug on it, from memory.

[Crazyfrog (Fab)]

the ITB'd cars.

d? what that for..........
ps vocky only made two of those his and mine wonder if he will do some more

[Exmantaa]

Completely different

What's different? The wiring/pin layout or the needed ecm signals?
Heard once the Lotus dash is CAN based??

[Aerodynamic]

Heard once the Lotus dash is CAN based?? Anyone knows anything about this? What is ECN signal? BR, Per

[Arno]

Toyota-based Elises (with rpm scales >8000) have CAN connection to the dash. Very early (2004-2006) ones still have some discrete inputs and only use the CAN for rpm, speed and some display info, but any later ones (2007 onwards) are full CAN-only and need some sort of separate controller if you want to hook them up to a 'traditional' wiring loom. Latest 2011/2012 ones do have some nifty features like a progressive (3 LED) shiftlight built in and more graphically oriented LCD readout at the bottom. Honda engines, at least the commonly used K20A2 series, are not CAN based so you'll need to get creative with the wiring and electronics anyway.. Bye, Arno.

[Exmantaa]

OK... Now do I run an LSJ ecu that normally drives a CAN based dash of a US Cobalt, so this sounds interesting. S2 Speedo and odometer are still based on ABS signal?

[Aerodynamic]

Toyota-based Elises (with rpm scales >8000) have CAN connection to the dash. Very early (2004-2006) ones still have some discrete inputs and only use the CAN for rpm, speed and some display info, but any later ones (2007 onwards) are full CAN-only and need some sort of separate controller if you want to hook them up to a 'traditional' wiring loom.

Latest 2011/2012 ones do have some nifty features like a progressive (3 LED) shiftlight built in and more graphically oriented LCD readout at the bottom.

Honda engines, at least the commonly used K20A2 series, are not CAN based so you'll need to get creative with the wiring and electronics anyway..

Bye, Arno.

But putting aK20a2 into a Speedster would be perfect then, Speedsterdoesn´t have a CANsystem and neither does the engin.
I just found out that Lotus Elise S1 have have a cluster looking the same as S2 and speedster and also 8k rpm scale.
Could this work?

BR, Per

[Arno]

OK... Now do I run an LSJ ecu that normally drives a CAN based dash of a US Cobalt, so this sounds interesting.
S2 Speedo and odometer are still based on ABS signal?

There are 3 distict dash types/connections on the Elise:

- S1 Elise => STACK unit with discrete inputs, direct resistor input for coolant temperature and direct connection to (inductive) pickup on rear axle toothed ring for speedo
- S2 Elise with Rover engine => (8000rpm dial max) Original STACK and later Shurlok: very close to VX220 with discrete inputs, PWM coolant signal from ECU and speed signal from ECU
- Early Toyota S2 Elises (111R) => (10k rpm dial max) CAN based for some functions, still some discrete inputs
- Late Toyota S2 Elises/Exiges => (10k rpm dial max) Full CAN based connection, new dash design at later date (eg. black back plate on dials). May still have discrete speed pulse input for odometer counter

In your case the latest dash could be interesting, but you may need to use some of the (commercially available) CAN translators to convert clock/message rates and convert message formats sent from the LSJ ECU to the format used/interpreted by the Lotus dash.

May need some fiddling/debugging with the CAN translator to get it to work completely, but it should be possible.

Bye, Arno.

[Arno]

But putting aK20a2 into a Speedster would be perfect then, Speedsterdoesn´t have a CANsystem and neither does the engin.
I just found out that Lotus Elise S1 have have a cluster looking the same as S2 and speedster and also 8k rpm scale.
Could this work?

Yes.. With the Honda you have 2 options like is done on most Elise conversions:

- S1 STACK
- Rover S2 STACK/Shurlok

They are very similar and most connections are the same. The biggest difference is in the signal for the coolant temperature and for the speed signal.

The coolant temperature display on the S1 STACK is done via a direct connection from the STACK to a temperature sensor (NTC resistor) in the cooling system.
The vehicle speed signal on the S1 STACK is taken directly from a sensor on the rear axle with a toothed ring on the outer CV and inductive pickup on the upright (low voltage sine-wave signal)

So this needs no interaction with the ECU. You just need to install the correct sensor(s) and a speed pickup with the correct toothed ring for it to work.

The coolant temperature display on the S2 STACK is a PWM coded signal from the ECU (like the VX220/Speedster from the engine ECU).
The vehicle speed signal on the S2 STACK is a high voltage pulsed signal from the ECU (like the VX220/Speedster from the ABS controller)

Both are different from the signals generated by the Honda ECU, so this can not be used for this function, but it is possible to build a small microcontroler and voltage converter to generate these from the direct sensor connections if you want.

Of course the K20A2 can do 8600 rpm like the japanese K20A without problems if you have it remapped, so even with an 8k rpm rev counter you don't get the full range

Bye, Arno.

[Aerodynamic]

But putting aK20a2 into a Speedster would be perfect then, Speedsterdoesn´t have a CANsystem and neither does the engin.
I just found out that Lotus Elise S1 have have a cluster looking the same as S2 and speedster and also 8k rpm scale.
Could this work?

Yes.. With the Honda you have 2 options like is done on most Elise conversions:

- S1 STACK
- Rover S2 STACK/Shurlok

They are very similar and most connections are the same. The biggest difference is in the signal for the coolant temperature and for the speed signal.

The coolant temperature display on the S1 STACK is done via a direct connection from the STACK to a temperature sensor (NTC resistor) in the cooling system.
The vehicle speed signal on the S1 STACK is taken directly from a sensor on the rear axle with a toothed ring on the outer CV and inductive pickup on the upright (low voltage sine-wave signal)

So this needs no interaction with the ECU. You just need to install the correct sensor(s) and a speed pickup with the correct toothed ring for it to work.

The coolant temperature display on the S2 STACK is a PWM coded signal from the ECU (like the VX220/Speedster from the engine ECU).
The vehicle speed signal on the S2 STACK is a high voltage pulsed signal from the ECU (like the VX220/Speedster from the ABS controller)

Both are different from the signals generated by the Honda ECU, so this can not be used for this function, but it is possible to build a small microcontroler and voltage converter to generate these from the direct sensor connections if you want.

Of course the K20A2 can do 8600 rpm like the japanese K20A without problems if you have it remapped, so even with an 8k rpm rev counter you don't get the full range

Bye, Arno.

So I stick to the current VX220 cluster. Can you help me build this microcontroler and voltage converter to generate these from the direct sensor connections if you want? And what would that cost?

Anyone knows where I can find a electric scheme for VX220?

Thank you, Per

[Arno]

If you can access SELOC then a schematic and the small bit of source-code for the PICAXE controller is here:

http://arc.seloc.org/p/5242375



The 'blue' sensor mentioned is this one:

http://www.elisepart...erature-sender/

Although you could probably (with some re-calibration of the translation in the code) use a different sensor if you want.

For the Speedster/VX (if you keep the ABS computer) then you would only need to do the temperature gauge circuit. Speed signal could still be obtained from the ABS output and sent to the dash.

Bye, Arno.

Edited by Arno, 29 March 2013 - 08:25 PM.

[Aerodynamic]

OK have to looki deeper into this. But where can I find a wiring diagram over the whole car?

[Arno]

For the speedster, here: http://www.speedster...rams/index.html Bye, Arno