115 replies to this topic

[Captain Vimes]

I need to get some proper brake pads for my 2.2 before I head on track and am trying to decide which pads to go for. Trying to balance the pros and cons of the following:

The obvious options:
- Pagid RS14
The most obvious choice, well proven over many years on many cars, will do the job BUT cost around £260. Which seems a lot but probably worth the extra couple of £ over the RS4-2's
- Carbine Lorraine RC5+
will probably do the job but I read some less good reviews from the Elise guys who got fade, plus they can crumble and don't fit the caliper well - Cheaper than the RS14 at £235ish
- Mintex 1155
will probably fade on track but cheap at £130 ish

Now for the less obvious:-
- Carbotech XP8
They get good reviews on other models but I think they're closer to a Pagid RS4-2 and cost more than the RS14 at an eye watering £320
- Carbotech XP10
Possibly too race focused for a NA which may struggle to get them up to temperature. Expensive again at around £320

- EBC Bluestuff
This is my current favorite option because there seems to be very few people who have used them on the vx/elise chassis that I can find but they have received good reviews elsewhere from people who didn't like the yellowstuffs. They apparently have good initial bite and offer all things to all men at around £150. The one review I could find was here:- http://www.ebcbrakes...r-joel-symonds/

The quoted friction values seem to back up the performance increase over yellowstuffs, but not sure how accurate they are against the pagids. Results are (Yellow/Blue/RS4-2)

Mu at 550 degrees - 0.31/0.45/0.46
Mu at 800 degrees - 0.21/0.42/-



So, anyone got experience of the Bluestuff pads or shall I take a brave pill and throw £150 in EBC's direction?

Thoughts on the others from those that have used them?

Edited by Captain Vimes, 18 March 2013 - 09:21 PM.

[Bumblebee]

Personally I'd stick to the tried and tested and go for rs14 I have these but can't really comment as I use my car for road only. Past experience and from other users are the ebc stuff is no good but then again i haven't heard about the blues,I'm sure some track day users will be along shortly to give you there views

[JG]

Ds2500 for the leftfield option. I rate mine very highly indeed. Far better than the CL in my view

[Captain Vimes]

Personally I'd stick to the tried and tested and go for rs14 I have these but can't really comment as I use my car for road only. Past experience and from other users are the ebc stuff is no good but then again i haven't heard about the blues,I'm sure some track day users will be along shortly to give you there views

Thanks - I read your thread on pad choice with interested, sounds like you got a good deal on the RS14's. If I could pick the pagids up for the price of the Blustuff's then I'd jump at them but I'm still trying to justify whether the extra £100+ is worth it.

Edited by Captain Vimes, 18 March 2013 - 09:31 PM.

[JohnTurbo]

I love my yellow stuffs but they are massive pads in my calipers. - I believe thats why they dont behave in ap 2 pots (too high pressure for the compound). I had similar love for them in my skyline. I also have had greens on the vx which were terrifying. I dunno if Blue are a similar formulation - in which case i wouldnt expect good results in stock calipers.

[JohnTurbo]

~(it would be useful of you to try em out!!)

[slindborg]

You need to be wary of ebc pads.... They seem crap (in all guises) on light cars but great on big stuff, eg greens were fantastic on my omega but dire on the VX/Elise platform and small hatches like Novas, clips etc. I'd only try the blues if you could get them for naff all as a point prover. Otherwise go with proper pads.

[JohnTurbo]

- This is why i tried yellows. They were super cheap for the billet 4's.

[Captain Vimes]

I've had yellows on 2 of my previous cars (supercharged mk1 MR2 & E36 M3) and thought they were at best adequate - the friction level was not very high and I would literally STAND on the pedal to make the corner but they would fade to a point and then stay at that level. A block of (reliable) wood might be a good description...

The reviews on here seem to back that up (low bite rather than fade )and the mu numbers look like that's what they would do too - so hopefully the increased mu of the blue's would translate into a pad with more bite AND fade resistance..

Ds2500 for the leftfield option. I rate mine very highly indeed. Far better than the CL in my view

Good call. I had some Ds2500's on a civic vti and rated them pretty highly on that too. Cost is edging towards the pagids though at around £203 for a full set. Be interested to hear more thoughts on these as a pad that sits in between the 1155/Bluestuff's and Pagid from a price perspective.

Just noticed that DS3000's are also available at £240 but suspect that these would be too hardcore for my ickle 2.2

[Captain Vimes]

Thought this was an interesting review of EBC's offerings for the Elise:-

http://ebcbrakes.com...sd-blade-discs/

Quote about yellows from Gordon Sheddon "About half distance you could feel the pedal get a bit longer and i thought that might be the beginning of the end but to be fair they stabilised and although retardation was slightly reduced, there was very little brake fade except the last couple of laps in the very high speed braking points…"

And about Orange: "With the Yellowstuff I was effective in slowing the car down, but with the Orangestuff I could really change the attitude and balance of the Lotus on the brakes,,, for a a serious track day user or racer this is crucially important.. The pedal stayed firm throughout the run and the limiting factor was tyre grip rather than brake performance.."

Which suggested that EBC can make pads that work in the Elise platform but I can't find Orangestuff's for sale for the vx/elise and I don't know where the blue's will sit.

[Jon A]

I've had good experiences with DS2500's and DS3000's on other cars. DS2500's are similar to 1144's DS3000's are similar to 1155's I can't comment on bluestuff pads but judging by the rest of the range I wouldn't bother even trying them. Especially when there are so many other known good pads available for similar money.

[slindborg]

You pays your money, you takes your chances..... If you are adamant about fitting ebc product to your car then do it. I just hope you are never behind me on the road

[Captain Vimes]

You pays your money, you takes your chances.....

If you are adamant about fitting ebc product to your car then do it. I just hope you are never behind me on the road

I'm just a cheapskate at heart and have many times kicked myself for not heeding the saying 'Buy Cheap, Buy Twice' but I'm also stubborn....

I've had good experiences with DS2500's and DS3000's on other cars.

DS2500's are similar to 1144's
DS3000's are similar to 1155's

I can't comment on bluestuff pads but judging by the rest of the range I wouldn't bother even trying them. Especially when there are so many other known good pads available for similar money.

The last part is the key point - the EBC's are priced below the competition by a not inconsiderate amount (£100+).

[MrSimba]

CL5+'s here Though the pad has had some very bad press both on here & SELOC I'll continue to use them whilst they offer almost zero dust, great stopping from cold & amazing stopping from hot! Think Chris Randal still uses the CL5 / CL6 combo on his Europa without any problem? thats got to be about the harshest environment for any pad!!!

[Captain Vimes]

I'm trying to convince myself but will still probably go for the Pagids and hide the receipt from the boss

[slindborg]

You pays your money, you takes your chances.....

If you are adamant about fitting ebc product to your car then do it. I just hope you are never behind me on the road :lol:/>

:lol:/>

I'm just a cheapskate at heart and have many times kicked myself for not heeding the saying 'Buy Cheap, Buy Twice' but I'm also stubborn....

I've had good experiences with DS2500's and DS3000's on other cars.

DS2500's are similar to 1144's
DS3000's are similar to 1155's

I can't comment on bluestuff pads but judging by the rest of the range I wouldn't bother even trying them. Especially when there are so many other known good pads available for similar money.

The last part is the key point - the EBC's are priced below the competition by a not inconsiderate amount (£100+).

So, for example, they cost about £30 for a car set? As 1155's are about £130 for a car set (well ok they might be a shade more but the point stands )

There is being different as stubborn, but then there is also being different and well thought out.

[Boombang]

What is your mix of road vs track driving, and what tyres/suspension do you run?

[Captain Vimes]

So, for example, they cost about £30 for a car set? As 1155's are about £130 for a car set (well ok they might be a shade more but the point stands )

There is being different as stubborn, but then there is also being different and well thought out.

Not sure I understand the £30 comment? Price is roughly £130-£150 for 1155s/Blues and £250+ for Pagids/CL5+ etc.

I'd like to think I was 'being different and well thought' out but I've dis-proven this before

What is your mix of road vs track driving, and what tyres/suspension do you run?

Tyres are 888's, suspension is Nitron Street series.

I always hope to do more track days than I do but total mileage will be around 3k per year and (hopefully) 3-4 track days... I'm also considering swapping pads for track/road use but would prefer something that does both.

[Bargi]

CL5+'s here

Though the pad has had some very bad press both on here & SELOC I'll continue to use them whilst they offer almost zero dust, great stopping from cold & amazing stopping from hot!

Think Chris Randal still uses the CL5 / CL6 combo on his Europa without any problem? thats got to be about the harshest environment for any pad!!!

and that seems to be the argument used if you have problems, ie: the box says "race use only", use them on road and tough titties.

Previous problems aside with the CL5+ I think they were a great pad on and off track and bugger all dust or squeal.

1155s are a good option if price is your thing.

[slindborg]

So, for example, they cost about £30 for a car set? As 1155's are about £130 for a car set (well ok they might be a shade more but the point stands :lol:/> )

There is being different as stubborn, but then there is also being different and well thought out.

Not sure I understand the £30 comment? Price is roughly £130-£150 for 1155s/Blues and £250+ for Pagids/CL5+ etc.

I'd like to think I was 'being different and well thought' out but I've dis-proven this before :wacko:/>

What is your mix of road vs track driving, and what tyres/suspension do you run?

Tyres are 888's, suspension is Nitron Street series.

I always hope to do more track days than I do but total mileage will be around 3k per year and (hopefully) 3-4 track days... I'm also considering swapping pads for track/road use but would prefer something that does both.

Blues, or any of the ebc colours can't be compared to the £250 pads.... You might just about be able to compare them with 1155's but the Mintex option will still be better.
The 55's were a lovely compromise pad in the middle of a sintered carbon item and a soft organic one. Good price and longevity.