306 replies to this topic

[Captain Vimes]

Without wanting to start a debate about suspension, I would like to increase my spring rates for something more track focussed.

 

Current setup: Nitron Street Series 350f/450r springs, 1" ARB, 110f/120r ride height

 

Problem:- Understeer & front end bite. In pictures the front wheel looks like it's almost lifting off the floor as the rear springs compress and the front ARB tries to resist roll. In my videos, you can hear the front tyres screaming for mercy..

 

I'd like to stick with my NSS dampers and just try some different springs. So, advice please on:-

 

  1. Spring Rates & Helpers: Nitron Suggest 450f/550r and no helpers required. Good plan?

 

  2. As the rears are 450 now, can I just swap them to the front (is the length the same)?

 

  3. Should I buy from Nitron at £55+VAT or is there a better supplier for the springs?

 

Thanks

 

 

 

 

 

[Tony H]

The lengths are different. I got a set off an eBay supplier for about £75. I don't think there is anything special about the springs.

[P11 COV]

This is what Matt Bentley recommended me for a track biased set up on Nitron one way adjustable.

 

"500-550lb front and 650-700lb rears with 250-300lb helpers front and 350-400lb helpers rear I recon for that much track. If it was more road then I would go softer."

[Kieran McC]

I have the same spring rating 350f, 450r on Nitron NTR 40 with no helpers, Ride height is 130r 120.f .

[MAXR]

If you want a setup for Road & track, then Paul & Kieran are in the right ball park. 120f 130r ride height. 150lb difference front to rear. Stiff helper springs, camber -2f, -3r & ARB medium, although mines on full stiff. But, that's with quantums, NSS may require a different setup! Next time we are at the same track day, try my dampers on your car? So long as you return them! Max

[Firthy]

425 - 550 is bearable on the road & track and a nice compromise. 

 

Sorry just re-read your post 450-550 should be good IMO

 

 

Edited by Firthy, 07 October 2015 - 06:12 PM.

[Captain Vimes]

Doh, ride height is 120/130, not 110/120. Camber is maxed out on the front (but still <1 degree). Rear has 1 shim left which should be around 2.5 degrees. ARB is on medium (I tried moving to softer but the drop links fail the wishbones). Quite a difference in spring rates suggested so far. I guess the first question is whether to go linear or dual rate. P11COV - what's the ride like on the road with your dual setup?

[PaulCP]

The Eliseparts steering arms or full bump steer kit will allow you to go as far as 2.5deg -ve camber at the front.

[Kieran McC]

Paul P11 COV has a turbo not sure if that makes any different to the spring rates

[Matthew Bentley Racing Ltd]

'Road comfort' has a lot to do with the damping characteristics and helper spring poundage more that the main spring poundage. Don't panic to much about the front wheel lifting. At what point in the corner is your understeer? Turn in/starting the load/fully loaded/corner exit?

[Captain Vimes]

425 - 550 is bearable on the road & track and a nice compromise. 

 

Sorry just re-read your post 450-550 should be good IMO

 

 

 

Elliot, do you have any helper/tender springs? 

[Captain Vimes]

'Road comfort' has a lot to do with the damping characteristics and helper spring poundage more that the main spring poundage. Don't panic to much about the front wheel lifting. At what point in the corner is your understeer? Turn in/starting the load/fully loaded/corner exit?

 

Initial turn in is fine but it then builds once any throttle is added right through to corner exit. More noticeable in the slower corners

 

 

Couple of pics from snetteron:

 

http://www.msvtphoto...cbv/16254875440

 

http://www.msvtphoto...cbv/16256346440

 

From 35-42s there's understeer at high(ish) speeds, 52-57s it's all through the corner at lower speeds, right from turn-in:

[Sutol]

This thread has come at the right time. I'm getting my Nitrons refurbed and new springs put on but I'm in a quandary as to what rates to go for. 450/550 has been suggested.

Edited by Sutol, 07 October 2015 - 07:15 PM.

[P11 COV]

 

P11COV - what's the ride like on the road with your dual setup?

 

I find it ok on soft settings.  ButI am used to a ridiculously stiff RS Megane Cup and a pretty Stiff MG ZT. I think I've forgotten what soft suspension is like!

[Matthew Bentley Racing Ltd]

Probably the spring rates not working with the camber. What did the tyre wear look like after the national?

 

 

[Matthew Bentley Racing Ltd]

This thread has come at the right time. I'm getting my Nitrons refurbed and new springs put on but I'm in a quandary as to what rates to go for. 450/550 has been suggested.

 

 

I would normally go for 100lb spring front/rear on an NA, and 125-150lb split on an SC or tubby.

[Captain Vimes]

Probably the spring rates not working with the camber. What did the tyre wear look like after the national?

 

 

 

Tyre wear is pretty even. The rears are still scrubbing the outside shoulder a bit more than I'd like but overall they're surprisingly intact and much better than before I fitted the ARB. edit to add - before the ARB, the fronts were wearing on the nearside shoulder (inside shoulder of drivers side, outside on passenger) on right handed circuits - which would make the steering pull noticeably to the left on the road. The ARB seems to have solved this,

 

 

It could just be sh*t tyres (RSR's) the latest set don't feel as sticky as the last set I had (could just be in the mind though). I'm going to move to the ZZR's shortly so hoping to put a bit more load through the suspension as a result and want the springs to match.

Edited by Captain Vimes, 07 October 2015 - 07:57 PM.

[Zoobeef]

i have

Front 600 with 150 helper, Rear 725 with 250 helper.

[Captain Vimes]

Thanks Mark.

 

There doesn't seem to be a standard that everyone has settled on for road/track work. I'm now more confused than when I started

[The Batman]

I have front 600 with 150 helpers rear 700 with can't rmemeber helpers! Very good on the road surprisingly as I thought it would be very harsh but it's not and really good on track