60 replies to this topic

[Ormes]

Hey .org.

 

Background:

Currently run Nitron Street Series 1, with all other steering and suspension components OEM other than 16/17 / 205/225 and a custom geo.

 

Car used to be mainly used on the road, but is now mainly used on track, specifically only really Castle Combe.

 

Ride height is currently 125f/130r ish and I want to reduce it.  With current ride heights, there is absoutely no preload on any corner and reducing the ride height any more will mean the spring is inches from the collar when unloaded.

 

I am generally happy with the NSS, but they are 5 years old, probably due a service, and if I could justify new shocks then I would...

 

Questions:

1) Has anybody fit helpers to NSS1, front and rear, in order to get the desired ride height (110/115 if required) without the spring flopping around when not loaded?  Is this just masking a problem / sticky tape and bluetack?

 

2) If I wanted new shocks to meet the following criteria, what would you suggest?

 

-Under £1500

-Good, but little needed aftersales

-1 way adjustable damping

-Adjustable ride height down to 110/115 if required

-Option of helpers front and rear if required

-A common spring size, so I can dick about with rates at low cost

-And clearly, a good, recommended shock for track use

 

Happy New Year .org

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[james_ly]

Following with interest as I also have the NSS1 dampers. I've recently fitted the rack raised plates to correct bump steer, will find out soon if it helps on track. I was under the impression that going below 120mm will screw up the geo.

[Nev]

Hi Alex,

 

May I ask why you want to lower the car any further? I'm sure you know what it will do to the handling, specifically the bump curve and roll centres?

 

You are welcome to use my spare springs for trials.

 

 

Edited by Nev, 02 January 2017 - 05:08 PM.

[Ormes]

Hi Guys,

 

I agree that the consensus is that going too low is bad from the perpective of wishbone angles etc., and for this reason, I don't want to go too low... but I want the range of adjustability to be there so I can dick around with the setup and see what works best for me.

 

[Exmantaa]

Is your front still on the stock shock mounting brackets? By fitting aftermarket lowering brackets you can lower the front by ca. 15mm and keep the shock in it's correct working travel. (search here; eliseshop/eliseparts brackets)

[Nev]

I don't think you will get any sort of objective answer from this forum. Most people just buy something, pay someone else to fit and geo it and have a polarised view that their setup is best.

 

After 100+ hours of geoing + spring rate testing my personal advice is stick to close to the OEM ride heights as possible.  As you are keen on mainly tracking it maybe step up 25% to 45% on spring rates, but if you want to absorb those undulations on the tarmac on Folly and Avon Rise I think going stiffer would be unwise.

 

As a pre-cursor, when you go to the track next time, you could do some fast laps with your current setup, come back in and crank the rebound rates up say 4 or 5 clicks on your coilovers - you will be shocked at how much effect it has I am sure.

Edited by Nev, 02 January 2017 - 05:38 PM.

[Nev]

Is your front still on the stock shock mounting brackets? By fitting aftermarket lowering brackets you can lower the front by ca. 15mm and keep the shock in it's correct working travel. (search here; eliseshop/eliseparts brackets)

 

That's true, though I would not recommend it. I used to have lowered ones on for about 2 years, and swapped them out about 3 years ago back to OEM.

Edited by Nev, 02 January 2017 - 05:56 PM.

[The Batman]

Isn't 110/120 the desired ride height for vx S1 100/110

[Aerodynamic]

This should be a bit depended on Wheel size and hubs aswell?

Isn't 110/120 the desired ride height for vx S1 100/110

 

[smiley]

"Desired" as in optimal angle to destroy the inner cv boot and to scrape every speedbump imaginable?

 

[The Batman]

This should be a bit depended on Wheel size and hubs aswell?

Isn't 110/120 the desired ride height for vx 16/17 standard hubs S1 100/110 16/17 standard hubs

 

 

desired as in optimal cv angle and wishbone angle for off the shelf shocks

Edited by The Batman, 02 January 2017 - 06:34 PM.

[Nev]

Isn't 110/120 the desired ride height for vx S1 100/110

 

I believe OEM heights were 140f/140r with 17" wheels on the VXT.

 

Alex has 16" wheels, so depending on tyre profile that would translate to roughly 130f/140r to maintain the wishbone angles.

 

Edited by Nev, 02 January 2017 - 06:43 PM.

[Ormes]

Thanks for the input so far guys

[The Batman]

i think its 130f/r standard height

 

im going from memory so could be wrong, probably am as nev is always right

[smiley]

Nev for mod.

[oakmere]

I think many are over 140mm as std.

[The Batman]

S2's are 130f/r maybe thats where i got the figure from

[2-20]

For the opel Speedster, it's 140 mm Fr/Rr as mentioned on page 14 of this document:

https://www.speedste...e/speedster.pdf

 

and here

 

https://www.speedste...sion Adjust.pdf

Edited by 2-20, 02 January 2017 - 09:07 PM.

[Nev]

16" wheel = 130mm front chassis clearance.

17" wheel = 140mm front chassis clearance.

 

The profile of the tyre has an impact on this measurement obviously.

 

Anyway, once you take a wheel and coil-over off and put a camber gauge on the hub and swing it up and down you can get a strong idea about how much camber and toe in gets added and subtracted. I and about 2 other people that I know of have created a bump curve to wishbone height graph. Once you do, you end up quickly learning is that lowering the car starts this bump curve and toe in far more aggressively. So it doesn't matter how expensive your coil-over is, the car will still handle poorly in a "lowered" setup simply because of the design.

 

 

 

Edited by Nev, 02 January 2017 - 09:47 PM.

[2-20]

And you need to keep a good ratio of bump/rebound travel.

I wonder how many NSS users are running on the bump stop at the front.