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Saab Engine In Vx220 Turbo


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#1 FreddeB

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 05:18 PM

Hi

I have a vx220 turbo stage 3.
Just wonder if there is any Saab engines that fit to the vx220 turbo gearbox?
Have heard that the Saab engines can handle a lot of power without change the internal parts.
How much power can the original vx220 turbo gearbox handle?

Want to have around 400-450 hp and that brings rather high costs on a Z20let engine.
Think it will be easier (and cheaper) with a Saab engine.

Fredrik

#2 Rosssco

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 08:19 AM

By far not a Sabb expert, but you get the older boat anchor (but strong) B20x engines, some of which have compatibility with the GM turbo gearbox pattern.

 

Then the newer, lighter, all alloy engines (e.g. B207) Saab engines which are essentially GM Ecotec engines, but they aren't much more robust 'out of the box'. Need a different gearbox bell-housing.



#3 smiley

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 09:21 AM

B207 has exhaust on the same side as the NA, so not so easy for turbo me thinks.

 



#4 tommobot

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 10:33 AM

I've a 95 aero with a B235 engine.. it's a brute of an engine and hammers the heavy old Saab down the road.. in standard form, it wouldn't suit the vx at all imo..

#5 siztenboots

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 11:25 AM

saab b204 / b234 or later b205 / b235 , if you want to keep your f23 gearbox

 

then turn it up to 666bhp , http://www.serioussa...2x4tribute.html



#6 Nev

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 04:32 PM

To answer your question, in my experience, the F23 can take about 40,000 miles of 350 ft/lb of torque. I drive fairly sympathetically. At times mine has seen 450 ft/lb and 420 ft/lb.

 

The F23 is nominally "specced" to receive 220 ft/lb in an approximate 2 Ton car. As the VX220 is half the weight of that the resting inertia that the torque has to overcome is thus 1/2, so this is why (IMHO) the F23 seems to last quite reasonably in our cars, i.e. half the weight but double the torque, in approximate terms.


Edited by Nev, 17 July 2019 - 04:35 PM.


#7 FreddeB

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 06:37 PM

To answer your question, in my experience, the F23 can take about 40,000 miles of 350 ft/lb of torque. I drive fairly sympathetically. At times mine has seen 450 ft/lb and 420 ft/lb.

The F23 is nominally "specced" to receive 220 ft/lb in an approximate 2 Ton car. As the VX220 is half the weight of that the resting inertia that the torque has to overcome is thus 1/2, so this is why (IMHO) the F23 seems to last quite reasonably in our cars, i.e. half the weight but double the torque, in approximate terms.


Thank’s for all the answers.
So it is possible to fit a Saab b204, b234, b205 or a b235 directly on the f23 turbo gearbox, great.
I checked the link in siztenboots reply and that was cool, but i think it is a little too much power😳
But i think its a good way to go if you want much power for a rather low cost.
And the gearbox looks like it will handle a lot of power, great.

Edited by FreddeB, 17 July 2019 - 06:39 PM.


#8 Nev

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 09:41 PM

Talk to Phil Hillyard on here, he's put a B204 in his Vx220.



#9 piwo

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Posted 18 July 2019 - 07:45 AM

B207 it's plug and Play for z22se.

https://www.mazdaspe...?f=320&t=115720
And with this engine You can achive

https://forum.vectra...ce89078159.jpeg

Z20let is different engine group. You can go to c20xe c20let.

#10 vocky

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Posted 18 July 2019 - 04:45 PM

the old saab engine might give more power, but the extra weight ruins the handling, which is why it's not a popular modification



#11 Doctor Ed

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Posted 18 July 2019 - 09:00 PM

a20nft ;)

#12 piwo

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 09:12 AM

a20nft ;)

A20nft is the same Group as b207 and z22se.
It will not match instead of z20let.

#13 FreddeB

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 08:03 PM

Talk to Phil Hillyard on here, he's put a B204 in his Vx220.


I have sent him a pm.
Waiting for answer.

#14 OneYet

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Posted 20 July 2019 - 09:04 AM

See if you can find some info about the Badsters. They used SAAB engines if my memory is correct. 



#15 FreddeB

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Posted 31 July 2019 - 04:12 PM

Now i have made some research for my project.
I’m probably going to mount the Saab B204 engine in my car.
I have talked to a person that works on a company that make inspections for rebuild cars so they will get a new registration and can pass the yearly inspections in sweden.
He says that if they se that the engine is not the original the car will not pass.
But there is another way to do it. I can make a new registration of the car, something that calls ”registration as a rebuild weichle”.
To get that type of registration i must make some more modifications. I must change the gearbox too and also the complete brake system.

So is there for exempel an 6-speed gearbox that fit in the same mountings as the original f23 gearbox?
I think it will be easier to get the registration if the gearbox is from another brand, for example Saab.
But if there is a vauxhall gearbox maby that Works too.

Next question.
Is there a breaksystem from another car that it is possible to get it to fit?
Maby a system from lotus Elise/exige, would that fit?

#16 vocky

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Posted 31 July 2019 - 04:17 PM

you could modify the subframe and use an Opel F40 6 speed gearbox.

 

Brakes, why not fit Opel 308mm front discs and some AP 4 pot calipers



#17 FreddeB

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Posted 31 July 2019 - 08:23 PM

you could modify the subframe and use an Opel F40 6 speed gearbox.

Brakes, why not fit Opel 308mm front discs and some AP 4 pot calipers



That sounds like a good option.
Does the Saab B204 fit on the f40 gearbox?
What cars have the f40 gearbox?
Is the AP 4 pot an aftermarket product or is it mounted on a standard car?

#18 Rosssco

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Posted 01 August 2019 - 08:15 AM

Could look at the Saab / GM F35 gearbox, but its a twin shaft design, so its a bit longer and unknown if it will fit..

 

https://en.wikipedia...35_transmission

 

Could you not fit a different ratio version of the F23 and claim its been converted too? Like one of the WR (wide ratio) boxes from a diesel-engine car..?



#19 siztenboots

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Posted 01 August 2019 - 03:45 PM

imho, it would be cheaper to replace the rods and pistons on the original engine



#20 Exmantaa

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Posted 01 August 2019 - 04:17 PM

imho, it would be cheaper to replace the rods and pistons on the original engine

:yeahthat:

Especially with the licensing troubles you face with a non-original engine...

 

And if you really need you can always build-up an even stronger block  with a X(Z?)20XER engine. (Thicker cylinder walls...)






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