10 replies to this topic

[davehutchinson]

Probably going to take the VX to Courteney to have a few things done to it but I'll probably start with just the C2 kit +11hp. How much difference do you think I'll see? Secondly they don't mention any torque increases, any ideas on how much it's likely to gain? I'll probably do the discs at the same time but leave the more expensive mods til my insurance drops below £4k!

[Thorney]

I don't know too many details on the stage 1 kit form Courtenay but I'd imagine you'd feel any difference via a smoother throttle response, 11bhp won't really be felt in grunt but more in more ueseability. Courtenay know their stuff, so I'm sure they'll be good to you

[davehutchinson]

Thanks for that, I'd be equally tempted to drop it down to AMD to do something to it but I'm not sure on pricing or performance gains for the parts used

[Thorney]

I've been helping AmD develop a whole kit for the NA - up to an including about 190bhp - lots of engine work. All in testing at moment and AmD won't realease until they're happy. It took 3500 miles of the Cannonball and 11 trackdays before they were happy to release the VXT stages so it takes some time. The NA stuff will be sorted in next 2 weeks. However, Courtenay are well respected tuners and I've no doubt what they do will be of highest quality.

[davehutchinson]

Thanks for your help again Whilst I'll probably only start with the 11hp kit, at 190bhp would the performance be getting on for the turbo or is it still lacking somewhat? Not that I'm saying the VX NA is slow, just I'd like to know!

[Thorney]

At the risk of upsetting NA owners - no. 190-200bhp from the NA will not compete in terms of outright grunt for a 260bhp VXT. However, there are many (not me) that would be happier with the 'purer' power delivery of 190bhp from an NA than 260bhp from a VXT and I do understand that theory. But bottom line, assuming same driver a 50-60bhp deficit in power would be hard to make up.

[davehutchinson]

With regards to a standard turbo though, how would it stand? I do like the way the NA engine feels, it's almost turbo like in it's delivery anyway as it does seem to noticably kick the power in at around 3k rpm. I will probably buy the turbo as my next car or when I get back from Palmersport!

[Thorney]

modded Na vs standard VXT? NA won't 'feel' as quick but probably would be.

[Purebob]

Thorney, you're dead right. IME a good turbo lumps ALWAYS 'feels' more powerful than an equivalently powerful na, and the VXT lump is a very well sorted turbo installation IMO. Dave, have you driven many turbos? The L850 drives like a diesel compared to the VXT turbo ! All instant torque, no revs, early death of power production. IME the power delivery of a good, light na engine allows more throttle adjustability for folks (like me) who enjoy a driving technique of carrying as much speed as possible through corners and braking as little as possible. For more 'racery' or outsright speed types, point and squirt driving with more acceleration and braking is better achieved by a turbo lump or a much bigger multi na engine. In practice, I reckon an NA will keep up with a T on a very twisty curcuit, but add a few straights and it'll get whooped by the T whose average speeds will go up owing to its higher top speed and it better acceleration beating the lighter NAs capability to corner slightly faster. A tuned na should close some of that gap while retaining throttle adjustability but will still find it hard to keep up on turbo friendly tracks IMO. The T is a very VERY fast car and thought the na is a genuinely quick car and a bit more raw & communicative than the T, its not nearly as quick on the right (i.e. most) tracks/roads. If you want massive point & squirt or track capability I'd start with a T and make it handle like an na rather than starting with an na and tuning it to T levels. Seriously though I'd suggest you learn your na first before you go off after more grunt. the driver makes more difference than the engine in most cases ! I'm looking forward to a go in a nitron modded VXT to see if its the best of both worlds !! Happy tuning !

[davehutchinson]

Yes I've had a fair bit of experience with turbo's. The Noble M12 and the EVO RS Sprint my dad used to race were of course very quick cars + I nearly bought an Impreza STI anyway. As I said, the NA is seriously quick anyway, far better than I'd hoped it would be, just I've got a little cash set aside for some mods and would like to tweak it a bit!

[MRK30]

Hi Dave, I've had the CS3 package from Courtenay. As already stated, they know their stuff (hence their work with the Sprint) so no worries there. In terms of performance increase, it was stated I'd get an extra 12bhp from the re-map plus 12bhp from the full exhaust system. To be totally honest, whether this is the case is hard to tell without having a RR session. I'd love to believe it but I just don't know...throttle response is certainly better and Jon shields (courtenay) noted mine felt considerably quicker / looser than his new std n/a. Personally I'd recommend the exhaust...lovely looking (my car is the lightning on the bottom of their pages) plus the exhaust note is great but there are a fair few options for exhausts with other suppliers so it's down to personal choice plus which supplier is closer to you for convenience. Either way, I think you'll be pleased with the result but just be realistic in your expectations...in hindsight (and being a bit niave) I was perhaps hoping for a more obvious increase in power but I think for this to happen, I'll have to save the pennies and go down the supercharger route. Good luck!