58 replies to this topic

[AndyB]

Hi, this might seem like a daft question. But which car is better round a track? A VX220, or a Scooby?? I know that a scooby is 4wd, and the VX is rear wheel drive, but which performs and grips better round corners.

[salopian]

Interesting question. Be good to hear what opinions are out there. Either way I bet it's darn close. Had a WRX behind me on a shropshire B road for a fair way - kept up well, he couldn't pass til we came to a 30 limit & then went over white lines at about 50mph+. No need for that I thought. You carry on. Just trying to provoke - I'm too old for that. It's not my style.

[wickywire]

A scoobie will beat a VXT in standard form on the road due to all the gizmos it has and these give the driver a false sense of security. With the VX you are the person who is driving the car. On a track and given both drivers are equal, the VXT would be quicker but not by much IMO.

[Purebob]

Hmmm I can only comment from my own experience. I have a personal test route where I assess my point to point time in similar circumstances - now before anyone gets too excited it involves plenty of legal speed limit BUT almost three miles of perfectly sighted twisties. Its a good test as to how quick I am in a given car. My record is still from 1998 in my std UK scooby. Distant second is our current 200SX, and everything else, including the VX is down the list from there. The Scooby makes heroes out of even fools like me and I carried more speed through bends in that car than any other I've ever driven. I never felt fear either. Or anything actually, driving the Scooby fast was as visceral as opening a fridge for a yoghurt IME. In the VX I am far more aware of hazards, physics acting on the car and my own mortality, and so I am slower by nearly seven seconds BUT on a track with a wonderful driver I reckon the VX's lack of weight would make it catch up with or beat a Scooby of any power. So in my opinion, most drivers would corner quicker in a rapid Scooby, simply because it presents the driver with less to do than the VX which communicates at a whole other level and makes the driver actualy DRIVE rather than steer and squirt as I found in the Scoob or a great FWD hatch. BTW I am an utter FAN of scoobies, and would love one again, but a go in a colleagues RB5 was like driving in boxing gloves and a romper suit after the VX a couple of weeks ago.

Edited by Purebob, 04 July 2004 - 05:07 PM.

[Louise]

Going by the Top Gear performance laps, I'd have to say the Scooby. But then again they did change the Stig, so maybe it needs to be done again Edit: Ignore me I didin't read the title (or all of the post )

Edited by Louise, 04 July 2004 - 05:40 PM.

[cheeky_chops]

On a track and given both drivers are equal, the VXT would be quicker but not by much IMO.

Dont know about the drivers being equal , but i've passed a current model WRX on the track in my 2.2 - he could just get away on the straight and was holding me up in the bends... Eventually he let me past Too much weight and power loss thru the 4wd

Never met one on the road.

[toreide]

I own a VX220, and my experience with this car so far has tought me that it is a car that really takes some effort to drive well. But it is a very rewarding experience when things start to gel. Evo (the mag) have many times expressed their frustration with the Sti on track: terminal understeer. For me, that means you either need to spend a lot of money on suspension work. or look elsewhere (Mitsu Evo...). As they test all their cars on the Bedford Autodrome, these are the hard facts: Evo VIII 1.22,85 VXT 1.23,55 Sti PPP 1.25,15 M3 1.26,85 If you're a good driver and like a challenge, go for a VX!

[benw]

I had a bit of a tustle with a WRX on my way home on Saturday night. He was braking way too early and putting power down much too late which, for me to say so, is pretty bad for him! When we drew up alongside each other at the trafic lights he tooted his horn and yelled something out the window. It sounded something like 'your cad' or 'your cat' which of course doesn't make any sense whatsoever so I pulled away on the green light.

[Purebob]

I reckon Bletch is probably right. VXs are designed to communicate, scoobies are designed to go as a fast as possible with the minimum of fuss. 4x4 turbos , Audi Quattro onwards whooped VX-like cars such as the (lovely) Lancia Stratos with Similar power twenty years ago. I reckon if the VX configuration cornered and gripped better, there'd be ME/RWD rally cars today. A great time to be a driver when we can choose either or both eh ? (cameras aside of course!)

[jazzyjeff]

I'your cad' or 'your cat' which of course doesn't make any sense whatsoever so I pulled away on the green light.

Sadly I fear that he was probably actually saying 'you', followed by a four letter word, also beginning with 'c' You were best to ignore him and drive off...

[M3 BFG]

[QUOTE]M3 1.26,85

Must have been wet

[earlystock]

At Bedford, I have always found it fairly easy to catch and pass Scoobys. The only time I have really known the person however was in early 2003. I attended Bedford in my NA and my friend in his P1...The NA easily outperformed the P1 on the corners, but tended to drop of on the straights, if he went out first, I could catch and stay with him, If I went out first, I pulled away fairly quickly. I suspect with the added grunt of the turbo I would easily of been able to pass....BUT...then it started to rain, and he was definitely quicker through the corners. Horses for courses

[PJG]

It sounded something like 'your cad' or 'your cat'

Are you the guy who had a cat inside the engine?

Maybe he saw it and was trying to save it from injury!!

And you ignored him

That poor cat had a chunk taken out of him!

[ShinyAndy]

Depends on the track really, but even a NA would be quicker than a "standard" scooby around most circuits (assuming it was dry). They understeer terribly in the dry and the brakes, even uprated, can't cope at a fast circuit. I was really dissapointed very quickly with my Scooby, yes they're fast but to get the same buzz you do from the vx you need to be doing almost twice the NSL which is why you see so many on their roofs through hedges

[Gedi]

As an avid Jap car lover and modifier, you knew I was going to get involved

There are so many different models of Subaru its impossible to round them into 1 car.

Your all mentioning the WRX, which is at the bottom of the ladder in TC scooby terms. These scoobies with their 208bhp are no match for a VXT. But you also have the uprated WRX's like in the picture Bletch showed with its FMIC (must be running high boost to warrant one).

When you start pushing into the realms of UK STI's ( STI7 > ) you'll start drawing level with the VXT's on the road, however the UK cars are still dumbed down versions of their Japanese counterparts and a well driven VXT will leave a STI UK on the track.

The classic model Jap STI's ( STI6 < ) are a step up. Running around 1.2bar boost, harder suspension setup, AP 4 pots, etc they are a little more raw and quicker point to point on the road than any VXT. The grip level, brakes and acceleration are much better than the VXT. Also bear in mind that these cars are so cheap and easy to remap, (you can do it yourself if you know what you are doing) that the majority of them will be running well over 300bhp.
On the track I think it would be a close contest with the VXT, and would possibly come down to the better driver on the day. The 4wd system would be a bit of a hinderance on track where its not needed taking into account transmission losses, etc.

The 2 door TypeR (and stripped out 4 door RA) were bred to be racing cars. One massive advantage they have over the regular STI is the Driver Controled Centre Differential (DCCD). This allows you to alter the differential from inside the car at any time. Opening the DCCD fuly will present you with a mostly RWD functioning car. With its shorter wheelbase, lighter weight, shorter ratio gearbox, I do not think that a standard VXT will be any match for one both on and off the track. Again bearing in mind 90% of these cars are modified they are a brutally fast car well within the realms of any supercar.

As I'm getting bored going through all the scoobs (there are variations within the small percentage of models I have mentioned too) I'm going to jump straight to the daddy, the Spec C.
This is Subarus ultimate track day toy. The spec on this thing is too long to list, but the Subaru engineers seem to have thought of everything and produced a car to contend with Lambos, Ferraris and Porche's. Quoted from Justin Wilson "Really enjoyed it having thought it would be boring. Broadly equal in performance to the 911 GT3 in terms of track speed, but it sounds even better. Very drivable and the handling is bengin, even though its a doddle to put into big drifts." I've even heard reports of it passing GT3's on track, which leaves out little VX's somewhat in the distance.
All this for a brand new for less than the price of a VXR
http://www.litimport...ru/stijapc.html

[benw]

Sadly I fear that he was probably actually saying 'you', followed by a four letter word, also beginning with 'c' You were best to ignore him and drive off...

Well, I would have thought so except his body language wasn't aggresive. It was like he was trying to ask me a question or something. He was pointing as well - not at me but at the car.

Wierd! I did first see him in Crawley so maybe that explains something!

[WoodenDummy]

All this for a brand new for less than the price of a VXR

Not including the cost of consumables, service etc!