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Stage 3 Supercharged Exhaust


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#41 smiley

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Posted 16 August 2016 - 11:09 AM

The NA miltek (2") is baffeled, but the baffles are only tagged, and backpressure will pop them loose on your stage 3. The oem turbo backbox (2.25") is also baffeled. No results known if they can take stage 3 SC abuse.

 

Your 2bular uses the same design as tullett i think (happy to be corrected here people).

A straight perforated pipe that goes through the middle of the backbox, with wadding around it.

With both we seem to be loosing the wadding very quickly, and the exact cause is still unknown.

Either heat, resonance, shortness of the system or any combination of this.

 

 


Edited by smiley, 16 August 2016 - 11:26 AM.


#42 MartinS

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Posted 19 August 2016 - 02:18 PM

Has anyone tried fitting a manually controlled exhaust valve like apexi etc make, seems a fairly simple fit but I'm guessing may not be able to take the full power of the car?

Would certainly help get through sound checks.

 

Martin S

 



#43 fezzasus

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Posted 19 August 2016 - 02:23 PM

Has anyone tried fitting a manually controlled exhaust valve like apexi etc make, seems a fairly simple fit but I'm guessing may not be able to take the full power of the car?

Would certainly help get through sound checks.

 

Martin S

 

 

Will only work if you have sufficient muffling to start with.

 

I've been considering this problem recently, mostly because my 2bular is unbearable, and my only conclusion is that we aren't using the right exhausts. Resonator exhausts simply don't cut out enough, however they're cheap and easy to make so it's mostly all we have.

 

Ideally we need baffled, high flow exhausts such as the flowmaster series. Once a suitable option has been identified, it would be easy to put an exhaust valve in upstream of the muffler for when you want it louder.

 

example flowmaster.

 

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#44 Jetpilot

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Posted 19 August 2016 - 03:25 PM

I believe Matt Bentley is working on a updated exhaust solution.



#45 MartinS

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 07:26 AM

So why don't we just get a flowmaster and fit it in?

isn't it just down to getting the biggest one that will fit in that space?  If thye fall apart surely they just need to be better welded inside?

I'm on my 6th silencer and cant help thinking sometimes that exhaust get talked about like theyre really something very clever. It took 4 versions until my 2tubular went on but at the end of the day its a pipe with some sound insulation(or was) that encased in a big tube around that tube!

 (sorry exhaust designers but that's all that type is at the end of the day)

Martin S

 


Edited by MartinS, 20 August 2016 - 07:35 AM.


#46 Kieran McC

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 08:59 AM

The NA miltek (2") is baffeled, but the baffles are only tagged, and backpressure will pop them loose on your stage 3. The oem turbo backbox (2.25") is also baffeled. No results known if they can take stage 3 SC abuse.

 

Your 2bular uses the same design as tullett i think (happy to be corrected here people).

A straight perforated pipe that goes through the middle of the backbox, with wadding around it.

With both we seem to be loosing the wadding very quickly, and the exact cause is still unknown.

Either heat, resonance, shortness of the system or any combination of this.

 

 

The Thermal velocity high temp wadding lasts about 6 months ,I packed mine twice last year after a black flag noise related at Snetterton

 



#47 MartinS

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 09:09 AM

I have a pile of high temp acoustifil, but to pack my exhaust involves taking it off (again) cutting it open, packing it, welding closed again. No one seems to know the exact best way of packing so if I do that, it could well be empty again a couple of track days later so to me, the logical way forward is to get a baffled silencer and if necessary cut it open before it goes on and get every weld beefed up.

Think this may become a winter project and for now will swap my open air filter for an enclosed one (as that massively drops the drive by noise) and just shoe my tracks carefully.

 

Martin S

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#48 Kieran McC

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 09:14 AM

I have a pile of high temp acoustifil, but to pack my exhaust involves taking it off (again) cutting it open, packing it, welding closed again. No one seems to know the exact best way of packing so if I do that, it could well be empty again a couple of track days later so to me, the logical way forward is to get a baffled silencer and if necessary cut it open before it goes on and get every weld beefed up.

Think this may become a winter project and for now will swap my open air filter for an enclosed one (as that massively drops the drive by noise) and just shoe my tracks carefully.

 

Martin S

.

 

The Tullette  back box is easy to fill as it unbolts into two sections ,You still have to take it off the rest of the system



#49 Jetpilot

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 10:01 AM

I am taking the Tullet of next week to change to a single tip and see if this does knock a db or two off, whilst off i am going to heat wrap the cat and back box, i have had some success with this in the past and whilst it doesnt necessarily make it quieter it can alter the tone.

 

Plenty of cars running rear engines and quiet exhausts with good hp levels and without the associated problems vx owners seem to have so cant believe its not possible, just cost prohibitive to develop i guess.



#50 smiley

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 10:21 AM

I am taking the Tullet of next week to change to a single tip

 

See if you can get the bottom one blocked.

Single tip looks so daft.  



#51 Jetpilot

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 10:26 AM

I am not that fussed at the moment Smiley, just want to see if works first, i was 98db static at Combe and have Goodwood booked 17th September, so will check then.

 

If it does improve will look at options although, maybe going from 3" to 2 x 2.5" may also cause issues with noise?



#52 Arno

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 01:51 PM

Plenty of cars running rear engines and quiet exhausts with good hp levels and without the associated problems vx owners seem to have so cant believe its not possible, just cost prohibitive to develop i guess.

 

Actually.. Quite a few modern fast cars like Fezza's, AM's and fast Porkers get kicked off of trackdays with their OEM exhaust systems.

 

Especially the 'flappy' ones tend to do fine on a static dB test, but on track they get way too noisy when the flaps open up under load.

 

And you can't keep the flaps closed as they will overheat the exhaust system with them shut.

 

Still... Some tradeoffs/compromises have to be made when it comes to dB reduction versus physical space and exhaust flow.

 

You can't expect to run virtually 'open pipes' with just small absorption silencers on 300Bhp cars and then remain under stricter (eg. 80dB) driveby levels unless you fit a few massive silencers and for instance sacrifice the boot in the cars to obtain that goal. (something more 'race' oriented cars tend to do.. and indeed it works!)

 

Also do not underestimate the amount of noise a lightweight single-skinned silencer will (re)transmit to the outside simply by resonating the outer surface/skin. (also a major source of any 'drone' in a car..)

 

To get high dB attenuation in a small silencer package you need to start going to chambered silencer designs like the OEM silencers are and do a double-skinned setup or ar least thicker walled silencers with ridges/creases folded in the skin to get it out of the resonance frequencies.

 

Will this be heavier? Yes, likely.. Will it perhaps not flow as well as a straight absorption silencer: Also likely.

 

But will it pass the noise limits and not pose a risk to the engine like many of the 'add on' dB killer 'plugs': yes, definitely.

 

Does it need to be expensive? No.. An adventurous VX owner could try start looking at building a system with generic chambered silencers for lorries and HGV's. These are pretty much starting at 3" and are meant to package a lot of silencing in small(er) spaces.

 

Will it look 'sexy'? No... Will it work: quite possibly.. Worth some experimentation I'd say..

 

Also a lot of lorry/HGV stuff for intake and exhaust parts has *actual* data on air flow capacities, pressure drops and dB reductions unlike most of the 'chooner' stuff that always promises a lot, but often end up kinda 'meh'..

 

Also dig around for possible OEM silencers from other 'big engine' or 'big horsepower' cars on the road and see which could be made to fit the exhaust area on a VX and then start digging around on some scrapyards and experiment! ;)

 

Bye, Arno.



#53 smiley

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 03:11 PM

Vocky did a nice conversion on his NA Miltek backbox, into 2.5" piping, pipo modding and full baffle welding iirc.

To bad there's no track measuring result from that.

 


Edited by smiley, 20 August 2016 - 03:11 PM.


#54 Jetpilot

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Posted 08 September 2016 - 09:27 AM

So i took the tullet off last week, i have to be honest, i am not surprised they arent doing the job for us, the inlet pipe is so close to the side of the box hardly any chance for any packaging and therefore sound absorption and same goes for the outlet, I guess this is just because its easier to buy pre bent tube sections. So half the box is being used effectively.

 

Anyway, went for a single exit and also wrapped the box in heat wrap, it seems to have given it a deeper tone, i will update next week of db readings as heading to Goodwood.



#55 Jetpilot

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Posted 17 September 2016 - 04:24 PM

OK some good news, but not really, managed to lower the static to 95db, but still wouldnt meet drive by's at Goodwood, peaked at 102db.

 

 



#56 Nev

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Posted 17 September 2016 - 04:45 PM

OK some good news, but not really, managed to lower the static to 95db, but still wouldnt meet drive by's at Goodwood, peaked at 102db.

 

 

 

Jeeze, that is super quiet.



#57 MartinS

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Posted 19 September 2016 - 09:46 AM

Jet pilot, is yours an sc car?

If it is, at Goodwood its usually the note of the sc coming out of the cone filter that triggers the meters. I have an enclosed air box I fit for there that literally removes all sc noise totally. I used it this weekend at HetHel and its weird how the car is so much quieter.

 

Martin S

 



#58 D-DAWG83

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Posted 19 September 2016 - 10:21 AM

Thats good to know, i think thats the way forward then.

#59 Exmantaa

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Posted 19 September 2016 - 01:05 PM

Jet pilot, is yours an sc car?

If it is, at Goodwood its usually the note of the sc coming out of the cone filter that triggers the meters. I have an enclosed air box I fit for there that literally removes all sc noise totally. I used it this weekend at HetHel and its weird how the car is so much quieter.

 

Martin S

 

 

Enclosed airbox for the win. thumbsup  It really is nice without the SC whine.. :happy:



#60 ultimate

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Posted 19 September 2016 - 01:26 PM

What kind of Airbox are you using, Martin?




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