69 replies to this topic

[Purebob]

Folks I've had my VX for more than two years and the engine is nicely run in now. Its magnificent but I am now familiar enough with the car that I can see that an engine change might add tons to the car, you know like sticking an type R Honda lump in an Elise does. The VX engine is wonderfully torquey but is breathless low down AND stops producing power at only 6k revs. Needs better breathing and another 100 rpm rev range at the top. I'll probably get some work done when the warranty is up, but until then I've been tinking of the engne options I'd stick in if anything was possible 1. renaultsport 182 4 cyl lump. Why ? - revs higher and harder than the VX na engine, and breathes better all the way up. Would make the VX quicker without lsing teh wonderful ability to control the attitude of the car in corners by the throttle alone. Downside ? Heavy I think. Almost as heavy as the VX turbo lump, so same handling effect. 2. E30 M3 BMW lump. Why ? You kiddig ? MAGNIFICENT engine aftre all these years. Spine tingling soundtrack, torque and revs akimbo. Downside ? Dunno the weight, servicing and parts are expensive. 3. Mazda MX3 six Why ? Tiny Six, same footprint as many 4 pots. highly tunable, can make 200 BP for less than a grand spent on reliable tuning. Lovely sound with a decent exhaust. Downsides ? Not made anymore, parts hard to get. Centre of gravity might rise as six replaces a four affecting handling. 4. CTR I-VTEC lump Why ? Powerful, lovely sound, torque deficit not so noticeable in an 850 kg car as in CTR Downsides ? nowhere near as usable as na VX lotus/Vauxhall lump. 5. BMW 2.0 d Why ? 200 plus lb ft torque and probably 60 mpg in such a light application. Downsides ? Poor rev range would limit throttle controllability. Massive torque at low revs woud provoke wheelspin all over the place and stress clutch and driveshafts. Heavy like all diesels. Crap noise. 6. RX8 rotary Why ? tiny, light, high rev range, rotor wear probably redced in such a light application. Downsides ? Poor fuel consumption, not much torque. Expensive parts probably. Ok theres a few of mine. What engine would YOU stick in if you could ?

[Richy]

Cut the boot out and lob a enzo in

[Jase_MK]

Who makes the smallest V6? Anything less than 3.0? edit: sorry Bob, slighlty OT, but there's an interesting article on engineering F1 engines in EVO this month.

Edited by Jase_MK, 04 September 2005 - 11:05 AM.

[speedyK]

Honda motor would be tempting (not possible for a road car in Switz. of course! )

Easy 220bhp, 6-speed box, crazy revs.

A guy on the German forum has done this. It is also around 50Kg lighter han with the 2.2N/A, so he claims. Komotec did the conversion.

>here's< an site showing one fitted to an S1 Elise.

Conversion cost about 23,000 Euro. OTOH, for about 8,000Euros, you can get 250bhp and far more torque with the Hi-Tec (in the UK Courtenay) stage 2 supercharger. There are those though who say that torque is not so important – a current F1 only has about 300Nm apparently, but spins up to 18,000rpm. The Honda with its low inertia, 9,000rpm engine is more responsive and can be about 30% lower geared to give more response at the rear wheels than the GM set-up.

Explanation (from german site):

Honda 6-speed und GM 5-speed Turbo box in top gear are both set to ca. 250km/h topspeed. The Honda spins at 9,000rpm, the GM Motor ca. 6,000rpm. If you drive, for example, at half Vmax in top gear (125km/h), the Honda turns over at 4,500rpm, the GM at 3,000. Due to this ratio difference, the Honda motor only needs only two thirds as much torque to achieve the same pulling power at this point, which it achieves through its higher rpm (3000/4500). (?)

A revvy engine is certainly good fun, but you'd really have to lust after that screamer experience to justify the price differential, IMO.

Speedster with Honda engine:

Attached Files

•  Honda_Speedster.jpg   48.26KB   0 downloads

[tangovx]

i think an alfa 164 or 155, 2.5 to 3.2 v6 engine would be nice, loads of torque and revs. plus they have up to 250 bhp in standard trim! you can pick up a whole donor car for bugger all! on the other hand the narrow angle golf and corrado v6 might be an option. its only got a thirty degree vee to save space you could go for the vag group 1.8t engine its very tweakable and if radical use it to extreme effects its got to be better than the z20let! treason!

[Richy]

I can get my hands on a Honda engine pretty easy... Does anyone in the UK fit the Honda engine I also know of a 200bhp 2.0l Clio wiliams engine, i wonder if that would fit

[HRL]

I've got a TSR race-prepped VW 2.9 VR6 engine with only 30,000 motorway miles on it if anyone is interested. Was £4,500 fitted. Not been driven for 18 months. Yours for £1,250.

[speedyK]

Found a nice movie of a Honda-powered S1 Elise in action at the Nürburgring F1 track.

Takes a while, as it's a big file, but great footage

Don't know if the Exige S2 is stock or a Lotus 240bhp S/C or the Swiss 263bhp S/C (that's the move I would make if I could justify/afford it) but he seems to be fairly quickly underway.

>here<

[rez]

After owning an rx7 a while ago I would love to see if the 13B would fit, these are pretty small, might only be room for a single turbo though... Also thought the s2000 engine as shown above would be a good choice as well.

[minime]

for me i would like the small v8 that is going into the radical sr8! mated to a quaife 6 speed sequential box!

Edited by minime, 04 September 2005 - 12:13 PM.

[Scottieb]

I can get my hands on a Honda engine pretty easy...

Does anyone in the UK fit the Honda engine

I also know of a 200bhp 2.0l Clio wiliams engine, i wonder if that would fit

Oh my god I've just shot my bolt all over the screen when i saw that picture of the honda K20 in a VX!!

Richy, I've been thinking about this swap ever since i got the VX and put my foot down only to be dissapointed by the lumpy power delivery of the VXT. I would love to put one of these lumps in a VX. How come you can get a cheap engine? how much are we talking? If i do mine, it wont be a problem to do another so we could work something out?

[davied]

Is it my mis-conception but are GM not planning a 3.2 litre version of the VX. excuse me if im wrong but i'm sure i read this somewhere! I Might have been one a those E.T abductions or summat though. That would defo be worth a look! I cant believe that some of u guys yearn for such massive speeds, BHP'S, Power to weight ratios! With rising fuel bills, and ultimately, raised runnin costs, only the supposed elite (superstars) will be driving non-electirc powered automobiles!! Don't get me wrong, it would be an awesome experience in a sooper-dooper VX, and no doubhts, wiv some a the power-house being suggested on this thread, the car could be a serious front-runner!

[Richy]

I can get my hands on a Honda engine pretty easy...

Does anyone in the UK fit the Honda engine 

I also know of a 200bhp 2.0l Clio wiliams engine, i wonder if that would fit

Oh my god I've just shot my bolt all over the screen when i saw that picture of the honda K20 in a VX!!

Richy, I've been thinking about this swap ever since i got the VX and put my foot down only to be dissapointed by the lumpy power delivery of the VXT. I would love to put one of these lumps in a VX. How come you can get a cheap engine? how much are we talking? If i do mine, it wont be a problem to do another so we could work something out?

I have a mate who repairs damaged cars, he has had a few total loss TypeRs [rear damage] pass through his hands and both the engines were mint in them, one had only 6k on it

Ive never really thought about that engine and the VX mating!
Untill i saw speedy's piccy

Them getting another honda lump wouldn't be a problem, I shall find out prices monday


Would you do the swap yourself Scottie

Edited by R1CHY, 04 September 2005 - 02:55 PM.

[Jim_Cross]

It would have to be a Honda engine for me I think, having heard and seem Honda Elises in action. Sinclaire are building a 2.4l V8 Elise - but I think that'll be track-legal only Definitely wouldn't take an Audi 1.8T (too dull). New 2.0 FSI Turbo engine from the MkV Golf GTi would be worth a look - meant to be a much more interesting engine. However, I'd wait to see how Thorney's upper stages of tuning go for the NA first. A Honda swap costs something like £10k in the Elise, which is done quite often, and is still not without it's problems. Going for a new conversion would cost fortune! I think you'd find a remap, exhaust, induction and flywheel would help the breathing and responsiveness of the engine greatly, for a lot less money! Factor in throttle bodies and a custom ECU, and it could get very interesting...

[Scottieb]

you could do it for a lot less than 10K if you were willing to get the spanners out yourself. I think you'd be looking at the price of the engine plus about £1200 for an ecu, mounts, hoses, etc and a lot of time and effort!!

[Scottieb]

Factor in throttle bodies and a custom ECU, and it could get very interesting...

If your talking individual throttle bodies, then that would be good!

[danyeates]

I'd be interested in a Honda engine, always wanted to do a hybrid project. Used to want to put a B16A 160bhp honda engine in a Mini when I used to have them, if anyone knows of one could still be tempted! Would like to look into an engine change in a Lotus/VX though, anyone got any info or a web site with what's required fitting a Type R lump. Are things like mounts easily made, are there templates or drawings that can be used to get parts machined up? Dan

[danyeates]

How much would a Type R engine cost roughly?

[Jase_MK]

Definitely wouldn't take an Audi 1.8T (too dull).

Agreed (although I was behind an Audi Elise on a run once and it was very rapid). IMO, it's not about having a turbo (or any forced induction) engine in the VX.

You want something capable of producing 250-300 bhp in a reasonably high state of NA tune. Nice little lightweight 2.5 V6 or something.

That's my ideal anyway...

[danyeates]

Toyota VVTI 140 engine with a C2 Turbo? Fitted in a lot of new shape Celica's. The 140 engine has better compression suited to the turbo conversion, apparently. The C2 turbo conversion puts it to over 200bhp.