95 replies to this topic

[minime]

i have booked a rolling road session at amd on thursday......it s not like the saturday session as they do a bit more setup and testing......so all will be revelled on thursday/friday..... as to getting extra power with the software please think about this....as my car was running lean and the engine management was cutting off power by between 10-15% it would suggest that when all is working well 173-182bhp and approx 175lbft of torque.....but lets wait until thursday as we can only speculate! for those of you that are going to be at donington you will be the first to know! ps....i am having my suspension further tweeked following seeing thorneys car! also i will report on the ebc gooved and dimple discs that i am having fitted to the front wheels of my car too! pps.... mani had a go in my car at the weekend....as him about the short shifter apparently it is available for the turbo as well

[iandhd]

Steve, are you rolling back to a previous version of Regal's s/w or testing the new version?

[minime]

i shall be using the same as in mani s ( cant remember which ver....) and as soon as the next version is available i will test that one aswell.....

[Dave T-S]

as my car was running lean and the engine management was cutting off power by between 10-15%

minime
I would personally absolutely no way run software that acts like this! You are relying on the ECU and its sensor inputs to try and correct a fault that is apparently being created by the software, it only needs one time for this not to get corrected, or not to be able to retard the ignition enough, and you may end up with a nice big ventilation hole in a piston! The hot weather will only exacerbate this!

I an not knocking the software, but your engine may be living on borrowed time running like this.

Edited by Dave T-S, 05 August 2003 - 10:45 AM.

[ddpunter]

how about running it on optimax? does anyone know if the extra octane will help? cheers d

[iandhd]

All this talk of running lean I'm wondering if a better fuel pump or injectors helps? Isn't that one of the first things that gets changed when Imprezas get PPP-ed.

[Thorney]

how about running it on optimax?
does anyone know if the extra octane will help?
cheers
d

I run mine on Otimax and Millers Octane booster, I can't say I can feel any huge difference but I'm happier kowing a high octane is runing through it.

[Ricky2772]

.... remap here, remap there.... an experienced chiptuner checked my speedy, connected to the diagnostic port, and said that the possible interventions on such stock ECU are VERY limited, almost useless, performance-wise...... so the only real option would be to install a totally new ECU, fully programmable. other owners in france, germany and switz went to such route, and most of them got ZERO results as well... few lucky gits got their money back, while others, like me.... VXT is probably a totally different ballgame....

Edited by Ricky2772, 05 August 2003 - 11:19 AM.

[Dave T-S]

It's true most smaller capacity NA engines do not gain much by chipping/remapping. Basically all you can do is increase the injector duty cycle (open time) to chuck more fuel in in certain parts of the map, such as where the manufacturer deliberately sets them up leaner to meet government fuel economy figures etc. There's only so much fuel the engine can run before it just pours out of the exhaust - the ideal air/fuel ratio (stoichiometric) is around 14.7 to 1. I'd much rather chuck too much fuel in and potentially suffer bore wash than too little, detonation & a holed piston or two though! Turbo engines are a different ballgame as you can play around with wastegates and the like to make turbo spool up time quicker. And yes, the MY02 Impreza STi PPP has an uprated fuel pump because Prodrive found they were leaning out at high revs. You wouldn't need one on an otherwise fairly standard NA VX as there should be plenty of capacity in the standard pump. Optimax may give you one or two extra degrees of ignition advance before the ECU tries to back it off. The potential problem is that the ECU will only have a finite amount of ignition advance and retard, and if you run beyond these parameters you will take the safety net away.

Edited by Dave T-S, 05 August 2003 - 12:35 PM.

[PaulCP]

Never thought i'd want to go back to setting up twin 45's but at least you could control the mixture on them!! My understanding from the RR day was that mine was running lean but not mega lean (between 2% & 5%) which the ecu should be able to cope with. I guess the high flow intake manifold will be the main cause & i'm not overly concerned at the moment since the plugs look OK. A question for all you techis out there, if the car is running lean would a plug change help & if so should it be hotter or cooler. I used to know all this stuff but stopped playing with cars internals many years ago. Paul

[iandhd]

A question for all you techis out there, if the car is running lean would a plug change help & if so should it be hotter or cooler.

I guess the cooler running Iridium plugs would be advantagous. There was a long thread about this a month or so back. Since there is more heat from the increase in oxygen I suppose cooler plugs are the way to go.

[Dave T-S]

A question for all you techis out there, if the car is running lean would a plug change help

Absolutely not!

The problem with running lean is there is too much air, or too little fuel in the mixture. You either need to reduce the air going in, or as is more usual get more fuel in!

The plug temperature range is only relative to the *correct* fuel mix. It is true a rich charge is likely to require a hotter running plug and a lean charge a cooler running one. Just because a particular engine is running lean (and therefore almost certainly hotter combustion chamber temps than usual) the correct way to deal with this is to richen the mixture, not change to a cooler plug - this is dealing with the symptom, not the cause.

Edited by Dave T-S, 05 August 2003 - 01:16 PM.

[ddpunter]

sorry to do it again, but would running optimax help? cheers d

[Dave T-S]

Probably a little, but again it's dealing with the symptom, not the cause. If you are running lean because of insufficient fuel being supplied by the ECU, you should deal with that first!

[Timboski]

Just to really cause confusion I discovered that the Regal remap I had done on my VXT was not firing the radiator cooling fan on . . . found this out in a queue of crawling London traffic . . 110c on the gauge - and it felt similar in the car too what with the heat generated by worry and panic of warped cylinder heads etc! They bantered with the chip guru who sent another file over . . same result - no fan. Oh well, just have to put up with the 200bhp again until they sort the software.

[Thorney]

Just gets worse doesn't it? Air/fuel mix is one of the main things you want ensure is right, too rich and it'll coke up the plugs (regardless of which ones they are) too lean and you'll put a hole in a piston. Even short distances running too lean can cause irrepariable damage. Its true most modern ECU's should detect a lean mixture and back off to save the engine but ECU's sometimes fail through sensors dying and tbh if a remap is casuing the problem - change/remove the map. One of the reasons I went to AmD for all the work on my car is that they do all the mapping work on site and adjust it to your car so it truly is a custom remap so it is written for the other mods to work in harmony. I find the concept of 'sending away' for another map a bit wierd tbh, but lots of people do it.

[iandhd]

I told the guys at AMD that I thought I might be running a bit lean but they said all the n/a's run a bit lean and mine didn't show any problems whatsoever. I've only got the Regal backbox, K&N and precat removed and I got the second highest n/a bhp on the day. Is this a sure sign to quit while I'm ahead (ie; very little ££ spent) or would/could the remap upset things further. You guys have got me all worried now.

[cheeky_chops]

No one mentioned running too lean to mee on the day - How do i know now ??

[Dave T-S]

Charge cooling is a big problem on the VXT. When I last spoke to Jon at Courtenay they were having problems with everything trying to shut itself down if it went above (IIRC) around 240bhp with the standard intercooler (NOTE - see what has been done with the VXT Sprint cooling wise ) I can't see how some people are claiming mega outputs from remapped VXT's with standard intercoolers with it all hanging together. As for the cooling fan trigger apparently being missing from the software....well

Edited by Dave T-S, 05 August 2003 - 02:51 PM.

[Purebob]

Interesting that slightly breathed on na VXs were putting out 150 plus BHP. This tallies with the Motor rolling road test that got 154 bhp for an unmodifed na and my dealer who rr-ed an NA as a customer felt it was down on power and saw 152 bhp ! I guess that extra PWR is why a standard na VX can keep up with a 111s S2 round a track? The turbos look awesome though, consistently high power production. Very nice....