32 replies to this topic

[roy]

Hi, this may be a stupid question, but i'll ask anyway. after taking a closer look at my brakes, it has the AP racing logo on them, but i'm sure the brakes are standard apart from the mintex 1144 pads that are on it. does the vxt come wit AP brakes as standard? i know alot of folk upgrade to AP racing brakes & i know for certain that folk dont pay £1.5k to have brakes like mine as mine are nothing special, but do all vxt's come with these standard brakes (supplied by AP) ? if someone can clarify that would be great.

[A13X]

Yep fronts are standard AP. The bigger brakes are the AP 4pots

[roy]

ah, thats what i was thinking. i think it just took me by surprise that AP supplied the standard brakes. so are the standard brakes classified as 2-pots?

[Guy182]

they are yes, twin piston AP calipers. the bigger ones you can buy are 4 pots. however its a big can of worms whether they are really needed for lightweight car. most people move to them to get rid of brake fade on track, however several people on the open forum think buying ali belled AP discs from plans, and some track pads like pagids can give you nearly the same performance for nearly half the price.

[waverunner]

however several people on the open forum think buying ali belled AP discs from plans, and some track pads like pagids can give you nearly the same performance for nearly half the price.

I had that set up on my VXR but on Plans recommendation I only had the AP discs on the front (not really necessary on the back even for serious track work). The stopping power afterwards was nothing short of incredible and certainly (unless you're expecting to race the car) I don't believe you'd notice that much difference by going with the 4 pots.

[t2vxt]

however several people on the open forum think buying ali belled AP discs from plans, and some track pads like pagids can give you nearly the same performance for nearly half the price.

I had that set up on my VXR but on Plans recommendation I only had the AP discs on the front (not really necessary on the back even for serious track work). The stopping power afterwards was nothing short of incredible and certainly (unless you're expecting to race the car) I don't believe you'd notice that much difference by going with the 4 pots.

STILL SEE YOU LIKE TO TALK ABOUT VXS.SHAME THAT MOST LOTUS DRIVERS ARE STUCK UP THERE HOLES

[roy]

[speedster]

they are yes, twin piston AP calipers.

the bigger ones you can buy are 4 pots.

however its a big can of worms whether they are really needed for lightweight car. most people move to them to get rid of brake fade on track, however several people on the open forum think buying ali belled AP discs from plans, and some track pads like pagids can give you nearly the same performance for nearly half the price.

Interesting thoughts. I've been think 4 pot all along. But this 2 pot alternate appears to make for sound advice. Has there been a face-off, 4 pot vs modified 2 pot? With 4 pot you get a larger disc area under grip than you would with 2 pot, so there has to be some difference in 4 pot stopping when compared with the 2 pot performance. Has anybody got a good grip on both 4 pot and modified 2 pot performance?

?

Edited by speedster, 13 October 2007 - 01:52 PM.

[wrightster]

what sort of price do plans charge for the discs?

[Adam W]

id be interested in finding out what plans charge for the belled discs and mintex/pagid pads as the standard brakes are appauling

[Guy182]

taken from the open forum:

Graham at Plans told me,

If the ultimate brake setup was 100% for a VX

80% of that performance comes from the disks

only about 10% extra comes from four pot calipers

So , based on that get these

http://www.plansmoto...ponents/#brakes

Quote:

Aluminium Belled 295/285mm AP Front Disc upgrade

S1 or S2 Elise, Exige 111R, Vauxhall VX
£565.40 Front only


These kits are available for the Exige S1, Elise and Exige S2 and Vauxhall VX. They consist of AP Racing discs (which are replaceable separately) on anodised aluminium bells. They offer a big improvement over the standard disc due to better material and larger diameter. They are the best disc available.

These kits use AP Racing products and can be used with standard calipers or with our four-pot conversion

[mandarinvx]

Do these kits use standard size brake pads

[Adam W]

i would imagine so, as it retains the standard calipers? im guessing the price above is plus fitting?

[Guy182]

plans site lists prices with and without fitting.. guessign the dreaded vat is to be added though..

[Ouija Board]

Just to add to the pot. (no pun intended) I enquired after a year of ownership at the first service with TMS, about upgrading to the Four pot AP system, as I had it on my previous Caterham super seven, and it was a huge improvement on the standard system. John asked wether I intended to track the car. I said no, apart from the odd day (maybe......), as it's not really my thing. (I wouldn't want to do it regularly and risk bending the car). However, I said it was my daily driver, and was driven hard on the road. His answer was very frank and honest . "Rob, I could take your money, but that's not what we are about, I feel you should upgrade the pads to Mintex 1144's as a start, and braided hoses, and you'll notice a world of difference. Far cheaper, and you can spend the money on other mods!" That's what I've done, and as all who have done it have stated, it is superb. (Adam get a set now!!!). So, I wouldn't bother. So when the disks need replacing I may go for the ali-belled units from plans, if they do offer a good improvement again, but deffo not the AP 4 pots. Too much money, and only noticeable after prolonged track work. HTH Rob

Edited by Ouija Board, 14 October 2007 - 09:54 AM.

[Adam W]

sounds good to me rob, my larini is getting fitted at the end of the month so think i might get a front pair of mintex pads then.

[dw1]

I'm with Guy and the others on this. If you don't track the car just upgradaing the pads will make a significant difference and it's cheap. Looks like adding the alli belled disks is the way forwards, you can always get the four pots at a later date. Having said all this I have recently thrown money at the problem and haven't taken my own advice because I'll have other priorities for my money next year and wanted to get it all out the way in one fell swoop so I can enjoy fade free track days - even though I accept that going for the 4 pots would probably only make a small difference over the disks. P.S. waverunner - what a beautiful exige, that front on photo is to die for. How does it compare with the VXR?

Edited by dw1, 15 October 2007 - 12:54 PM.

[subseamac]

if that's any help see my earlier thread on the subject of AP/Plans discs

http://www.vx220.org...=57035&hl=plans

(haven't mastered the art of the clicky yet..)

[Thorney]

We'll have our own separate ali belled AP disk upgrade in stock soon, will be cheaper than Plans (although I disagree on the percentages quoted). We've got 100 sets coming in.

[Pidgeon]

Quite impossible to agree with the percentages quoted. The reason for four (or more) pistons is as follows- If the brake master cylinder has a cross section of A and the brake pistons have an area of A x 4, then four times the pressure you exert upon the pedal is exerted upon the disc. To increase the pressure, you need to increase the size of the pistons, but you soon reach the size limit of the piston inside the caliper and the caliper upon the disc. Moving to more smaller pistons allows a larger piston area and therefore more pressure. However good your pads and discs, they are nothing without pressure To suggest rotors will have any impact above a few percent is plain wrong. Ali-bells are good for unspring weight, but the pad is the wearing part of the brakes and unless you want very soft discs they will not impact upon the overall performance to any great degree.