31 replies to this topic

[SteveA]

So I've bought myself a harness which can be used on either a wrap around or bolt in harness bar and it's time to pick one. From what i've read there is a very small posibility the bolt in's can shear in the event of a big accident but the wrap arounds can spread if they are not going through holes in the seats. Due to the lack of holes in my seats and more importantly because I CBA to cut any i'm leaning towards the bolt in kind. Any information that will sway me either way? Cheers Steve

[techieboy]

Bolt-in's are your only option without running seats with cut-outs. Simples.

[Duncan VXR]

Got a bar with the bolt in sections and eyes / clips for harness if anyone needs to swap for a straight bar - seats getting done next week no problem using it for wrap around just been nice and offering DG

[SteveA]

Bolt in it is then

[Retset]

I second that - bolt in. However, when I spoke to Jenny at MSAR she was so concerned about me putting in harnesses without seat holes that she said she would not sell me the harness knowing it was going round the seat - she has seen videos of nasty accidents where people came out of their harnesses. She said she would rather lose the sale. So I added grommets and, yes, it was a total PITA! Still I then put on a nice set of Schroth wrap rounds and was very, very secure in the car.

[mandarinvx]

I second that - bolt in. However, when I spoke to Jenny at MSAR she was so concerned about me putting in harnesses without seat holes that she said she would not sell me the harness knowing it was going round the seat - she has seen videos of nasty accidents where people came out of their harnesses. She said she would rather lose the sale.

So I got harness holes cut in too

[siztenboots]

Steve , if you fancy the drive down, I have a carbon fibre Mog full race seat that we can fit and setup to you.

Edited by siztenboots, 07 March 2010 - 08:59 AM.

[Retset]

Had I kept the car, a Mog was on the massive upgrade list I had worked out. A full harness done up mega tight is a huge improvement over standard and allows you to be relaxed at the wheel. There is nothing like big tall sides as well though!

[ianrm]

I would NOT use any Harness without seat holes, bolt in or wrap around !

[SteveA]

Steve , if you fancy the drive down, I have a carbon fibre Mog full race seat that we can fit and setup to you.

I have thought about Mog's but I really like my heated seats

[Mike (Cliffie)]

I would NOT use any Harness without seat holes, bolt in or wrap around !

I agree 110% with Ian, dangerous stuff. Just fit the grommets or fit seats with cut outs but don't run harnesses on standard seats; please.

Edited by Cliffie, 08 March 2010 - 03:34 PM.

[SteveA]

I think for now i'll go bolt in without cutouts and wear my OEM seat beat over the top till I can be arsed to cut the holes.

[TheRealVXed]

Hi I have been thinking about this. Can someone explain the rational behind having to have harness holes as my brain won't accept it!! If the bolts on the harness bar are slightly closer together than the width of the seat, presumably if you are forced forward in your seat the harness will try to straighten thus making the shoulder straps force together (possible decapitation issue here lol), but no way they could fall off your shoulders, especially if you had done them up nice and tight? In terms of side impact a harness of any kind has to be more effective than the standard belt as there is a harness over each shoulder that is not contained by the seat, rather than just over one shoulder, which is also not contained by seat holes? Am i just being thick?

[ianrm]

Without the seat holes there will always be the risk of the belts seperating enough to let your body slide through. Your body can deform quite easily in an impact. It may be that the crash is a roll over, is backwards or at an angle and not forwards as most expect. Trust Jenny at MSAR and never use harness's without seat holes.

[SteveA]

I also struggle to see how bolt in harnesses could cause that much of an issue. Surely you are strapped so tightly that the shoulder straps will be kept in place by the lap strap. I also think that the way grommets from MSAR are installed the belts are slightly twisted, don't sit exactly where they should and look as if they would cause just as much damage. Regardless I have decided to cut holes anyway, based more on the fact that it looks cool

[peterg]

Surely you are strapped so tightly that the shoulder straps will be kept in place by the lap strap

But consider for a moment an impact such as going backwards into a barrier, it's not impossible for the front seat mountings to be ripped out allowing the seat and your body to tilt backwards, then if the car continues to spin it could then hit a barrier/another car going forwards but the top of your body is not so restrained and could slip through the harness this time... however, if you have holes in the seat then in this situation the shoulder straps are still held close enough to make it much less likely to happen

[SteveA]

it's not impossible for the front seat mountings to be ripped out

I'd say it's just as likely the the part where the bar bolts into the roll hoop would snap and render the entire hole/no hole agrument void.

Edited by SteveA, 16 March 2010 - 10:11 AM.

[Retset]

As for the grommets looking twisted, yes they do! But once you have fitted them, and threaded in your nice Schroth harness, you find to your relief that the belts go exactly where you want them

Pics of my (now Bargi's) slots after about 15 hours in the garage doing them

[TheRealVXed]

So are you saying that bolt on harnesses without cut outs in the seats are less safe than the standard seat belt? I am thinking about this is a purely "I go on a track day occasionally to have fun without setting the fastest lap time and the rest of the time i want to feel more connected with the car" kind of way. In terms on the rails shearing from the floor not sure any kind of harness would help that much if that happened? if the forces were that bad it would surely be enough to just rip the seat to bits with harness holes? I am reluctant to pay someone circa £200 to cut my seats for something that i can't get my head round!! Does anyone have a physics type reason for harnesses having to go through holes? Thanks for the info guys VXed

[rcvaughan]

How about crossing wrap arounds behind the seat? No chance of them spreading