57 replies to this topic

[FLD]

That makes making them very easy slindy

Hmm cheers for that techie that makes 30' a happy medium I was kinda hoping Winstar would pop up and make my life easy

The angle will depend on what speed you want them to be most effective. Active canards are what you really want.

[slindborg]

they look active and the right size

[The Batman]

a nice wide arch kit with side skirts that match the width of the arches and some front canards just like the above exiges reveries charge alot of monies for there's! but as you said winstar if we need to reduce downforce then canards would be a bad idea, but how exactly could you reduce it?

[Bargi]

a nice wide arch kit with side skirts that match the width of the arches and some front canards just like the above exiges

[Winstar]

Mot isn't a problem especially for Jjj race car etc

How big we talking?

What do you think should be done to reduce front drag?

As far as I can see the canards creat down force in 2 different wat ways:
1. the curvature generate downforce in a similar way to a rear wing in the air flow going around the nose of the car and down the sides but as the front of a vx is square it would be dificult to achive this without having them stick out of the sides of the car, which I suspect is probably against reg. as well as MOT.
2. as they stick out infront of the car they act like mini spliters and create areas of high prssure above them to push down on them but this also increases drag.

Additionally the ones on the elise above are angeled so that they take the airflow up over the wheel arches so that it should reduce the drag they cause.

As for reduceing drag in the paper I read on the ECO-Speedster aerodynamics one of the main areas of improvment was to extend the nose to get rid of the blunt front end. I suspect that as with the canards this would be against as most regs require you to keep the production siloette. However you could cut the flat bits out then then channel the flow round the side of the car.

[The Batman]

ah right so probably not beneficial to have but if the planned widened wheel arches comes out then to use the canards to deflect some air over the top of them rather than no canards and directly into them sorry for all the questions just trying to get my very limited brain power round this!

[techieboy]

but as you said winstar if we need to reduce downforce then canards would be a bad idea, but how exactly could you reduce it?

You want to reduce drag and ideally not downforce.

Make sure the wing is adjusted properly. Make sure splitter is parallel to the track and not angled down/up. Fit some funky flat faced wheels. Jury rig a coupe back with a sheet of perspex (or marine ply if Lee's involved ) across the buttresses. Block up the front rad aperture. Lose the side mirrors. Go back to NA side vents. Vent the trailing part of the rear arch liners to make use of the rear clam vents. Add some of the small air deflectors on the underside of the front clam, in front of the front wheels (and maybe even the rears).

*Usual this is probably all bollox disclaimer applies.

[The Batman]

i need some dodgy 'paint' pictures!

[chris_uk]

i thought canards were there to reduce the amount of air going under the car rather than being there to solely produce downforce. downforce or reduction of lift is a byproduct of the air being redirected over the car. when the air hits a car it flows over the car but alot flows round the sides and then is sucked under the sides and then under the car, with the canards in place less air is passed down the side and thus less is allowed to enter the underside of the car. i might be well wrong but its how i thought they worked and thats the reason they are placed where they are.

[The Batman]

looks like the gulf vx220 has some canards, fairly small ones:



side skirts wise i was thinking ones like these:



wheel arches i need a sheet of ali!!

Edited by joe_589, 31 August 2011 - 04:50 PM.

[techieboy]

I'd pay more attention to the Badster cars that actually get used on track rather than the Gulf car, which has never been near one and is more of a show car.

[The Batman]

that second one with the skirts like what i was thinking off is called a badster car although i cant confirm! its called a badster car on lotuscars.se

that car also has canards, here is a clearer photo

Edited by joe_589, 31 August 2011 - 06:05 PM.

[starlight]

For all the 'aerodynamic' aids on the car, why would you compromise them by having the roof off and increasing the drag?

[The Batman]

To be able to sit up straight by the look of it Winstar

[starlight]

Although car design dependent, having the roof off/down on our products creates around 5-10% increase in Cd. Don't know the effects on the VX though. It also has an effect on the aero lift and balance. On a 997 we measured we saw a negative effect of having the roof down on Cd of 30% !!

[FLD]

The last couple of canard pics are all fenced. Far better! Best add them to the 'to do' list. Which is currently very long .

[Winstar]

Although car design dependent, having the roof off/down on our products creates around 5-10% increase in Cd. Don't know the effects on the VX though. It also has an effect on the aero lift and balance. On a 997 we measured we saw a negative effect of having the roof down on Cd of 30% !!

A german mag did some testing and it increases drag and down force on the VX, there is a post about it by SpeedyK from years ago but I CBA trying to search for it.

But as you said the main problem is that all aerodynamics are so dependent on the rest of the package it is very hard to know what the effects are going to be without testing, hence why F1 teams spend so much time simulating at testing.

Edit: found it

Edited by Winstar, 01 September 2011 - 08:54 AM.

[The Batman]

Cheers for the link I will look at that when I get home currently looking at some very aero aeroplane!!

[Cookies220]

Surely you could reduce front end drag by cutting a couple of fuggin' great holes in the 'bumper' and venting the air through the bonnet and wheel arch vents

[fred666]

Surely you could reduce front end drag by cutting a couple of fuggin' great holes in the 'bumper' and venting the air through the bonnet and wheel arch vents

pretty much sums up my front clam, although the reason behind my clam is more aesthetics.

i did however make these 'winglets' last week from carbon for the side of the car just before the rear arches. rushing i made them to small to attach lol so its back to the drawing board