56 replies to this topic

[severnless]

Thanks Ormes.The crank sensor hadn't been removed before as far as I'm aware.

After a long think about what to do next I have decided that one way or another I am going to get my VX fixed as I have worked out that with the knackered engine even if I completely striped the car and sold it as parts I would probably not even get back what I have spent on it since I bought it.
Before I start looking a what other equipment and tools I will need to get for removing the engine is there anybody near Lichfield Staffordshire that has good knowledge of these cars and engines that would be able to spare some time and have a look at the car with me on Saturday just to make sure before I start taking it apart that the engine is definitely the problem obviously there will be some beer money in it for them

Is examination of the bottom end shizzle possible by removing the sump and the balancer shafts? Sorry I am getting out of my depth now. Bring on somebody who's stripped an engine before and could maybe advise what could have eaten the crank sensor. Maybe post a picture of the damage to the sensor?

I agree with Ormes, would defo remove the sump and balance crap to inspect the trigger wheel on the crank, also look over the balance kit carefully, as if it is slightly damaged it can cause major problems with the rest of the engine. (as ive learned on my vxt!)
would love to come and help as i'm only a few miles away in Sandbach but have a serious case of 7 day working week syndrome!
hope it's not to serious.

[out on the bike]

DarryIB I am not planning on stripping the engine just yet I am thinking more of making sure it is the engine that is the problem and if it is just dropping a second hand one in for now then saving up to get my engine fully rebuilt probably with forged internals to make sure I don't brake it again. Ormes I am pretty sure you can examine the bottom end by going in through the sump but with the VX being my only car leaving me with just a push bike my legs and a gsxr 1100 with summer tyres that I prefer not to ride on cold wet/damp roads I am now looking at the quickest cheapest way to get the VX drive able again which at the moment seems like putting in another engine. Thanks both for your input and hopefully there is somebody close who has a better understanding of these things than me who will be able to have a look so I know what I am doing next.

[out on the bike]

Thanks for that severnless I will take the sump off to have a look at the weekend though as I don't really know what I will be looking for I will just have to see if anything doesn't look right and try and take some pictures.Shame you're on a 7 day week as I am getting out of my depth with this now and I usually do 6 day weeks and with the nights drawing in and no garage(though I have bought a gazebo so I can still work on it if it rains)I am getting short of time to get it fixed.Thanks again all.

[Nev]

Dude, im so confused why this bloody thing wont fire up at all. Did you replace the crank sensor? The one that is secured with just one bolt externally on the block between the turbo and drivers side ear? If you've checked /replaced/eliminated all the sensors, Im beginning to wonder if you have a loom issue. ie disturbed it badly somehow or snapped a wire in it. You are in a tight corner, I feel for u. If you haven't swapped out EVERY sensor on the loom, Id strongly suggest paying someone local with a VXT to drive up and start swapping parts with you 1 by 1. Its the only way to be sure. Any flipping engine getting air, fuel, oil and water will at least splutter a bit and fire up partially. It must be something electronic rather than mechanical (unless yout have the cam timings completely out.

Edited by Nev, 07 November 2011 - 08:43 PM.

[out on the bike]

Dude, im so confused why this bloody thing wont fire up at all.

Did you replace the crank sensor? The one that is secured with just one bolt externally on the block between the turbo and drivers side ear?

If you've checked /replaced/eliminated all the sensors, Im beginning to wonder if you have a loom issue. ie disturbed it badly somehow or snapped a wire in it.

You are in a tight corner, I feel for u.

Cheers Nev.I replaced the crank sensor but as I said earlier in the thread the engine had eaten the end of the old one and I did try and fire it up after replacing it but no luck so I took the new one back out to check it and it had a small bit of metal stuck to it so it looks like the trigger wheel may have some how moved or broken.

[Nev]

Dude, im so confused why this bloody thing wont fire up at all.

Did you replace the crank sensor? The one that is secured with just one bolt externally on the block between the turbo and drivers side ear?

If you've checked /replaced/eliminated all the sensors, Im beginning to wonder if you have a loom issue. ie disturbed it badly somehow or snapped a wire in it.

You are in a tight corner, I feel for u.

Cheers Nev.I replaced the crank sensor but as I said earlier in the thread the engine had eaten the end of the old one and I did try and fire it up after replacing it but no luck so I took the new one back out to check it and it had a small bit of metal stuck to it so it looks like the trigger wheel may have some how moved or broken.

pm me your mobile number, ill give you a ring, im amazed and confused now.

[Whiteboy]

Does anybody know foxy's number as he knows vx inside out and lives in Litchfield? Steve

[Pidgeon]

Does anybody know foxy's number as he knows vx inside out and lives in Litchfield?

Steve

Funniest thing I've read for a long time. Simon won't mind me saying he's mechanically gormless.

[out on the bike]

First a big thanks to partridge you came round yesterday to help check it all over again .We found it definitely has spark,fuel and compression though its obviously not all happening at the right time.When the crank sensor(New one)is disconnected there is no spark at all but there is when its connected and after taking it out there were signs of metal filings on it so I believe even if I can't understand why it is hitting the pulse wheel.I was going to drop the sump off this afternoon to check but after dropping the oil out and putting the car on axle stands I found that the sump is held on with No 9 female torx bolts the only size I don't have and all the setts I have looked at don't include this size either .I am now wondering whether to just give up on the engine and drop another one in or find out where I put my imperial spanners as I am sure one of them should fit on the torx bolts and drop the sump off just to make sure the problem is with the bottom end and not ECU related.Thanks to everyone's input on this as it is now driving me nuts.

[ghand]

Dont give up,think of it as a challenge and just think how happy you will be when you find whats wrong. you have to look at the pulse wheel.Dont see how but it sounds like its damaged in some way(bits of metal on the sensor) It is a strange one this .Any way good luck and keep going

[Pidgeon]

Rich, found this pic of the sensor wheel



I agree TIS does not help, I can't visualise how the wheel is attached, so can't understand how it may be out of location.

Agree the next step has to be to open her up and take a look, but given the position of the sensor, I think I'd cut my losses and pull the engine.

Ordered myself an Op-Com!

[techieboy]

Timing wheel is attached by 3 bolts to the end of the crank looking at the EPC. Are you sure it's filings from the wheel and/or sensor itself? Might be debris from some fuggered bearings. Anything metal in the oil filter?

[beginner]

Apologies coz this goes on a bit.. You've gotta get the sump off and find out where those metal particles are from. With the sump off you can rotate the crank into position with 1 + 4 bottom dead center and feel for play (movement) in the big end bearings. There is always movement side to side ie belt to flywheel but you need to check front to back. Rotate the crank again to check 2 + 3. Also using a pry bar or large screwdriver check the crank for endfloat. This is to check the thrust bearings. Place the pry bar between the middle (no 3) main cap and web of the crank and apply pressure to force the crank over. then alternate to the opposite side of the no3 cap to observe any excess play by moving the crank in the opposite direction. I have seen crank bearings brake up and thrust washers worn away but never due to being over-revved. Good luck.

[siztenboots]

Rich, found this pic of the sensor wheel



I agree TIS does not help, I can't visualise how the wheel is attached, so can't understand how it may be out of location.

Agree the next step has to be to open her up and take a look, but given the position of the sensor, I think I'd cut my losses and pull the engine.

Ordered myself an Op-Com!

thats a x20xev or leh crank as it does not have the middle gear to drive the balancer shafts. there is a good pic of the bottom end in the z20let is reborn thread.

[Pidgeon]

Correct as ever Steve, the pic is from George's LEH conversion thread. Assuming the wheels are in the same place on both engines, I still cannot work out how the wheel fits, as it is beyond a main cap??? Rich, I can bring you my engine crane most nights, unfortunately my engine stand is supporting a mates MR2 engine and I told him I would not want it back for at least a year!

[siztenboots]

i'm wondering if this could be an earth fault, something that got dislodged when the head was off. near to cyl four, there is a capacitor that needs to be connected to the block. other than that on the cam cover you have the crank sensor and the oil level , can't think of any other wiring that would get disturbed. maybe loosen off the four bolts to the throttle body to let it draw air and bypass the TB, unplug maf check earth wire to the ecu bracket bolt for continuity against ecu casing.

[siztenboots]

Correct as ever Steve, the pic is from George's LEH conversion thread. Assuming the wheels are in the same place on both engines, I still cannot work out how the wheel fits, as it is beyond a main cap???

this is a c20let crank, but with 5 bolts it looks straightforward enough, EPC says its a 3 bolt

[Pidgeon]

The current opinion is that the fault we are chasing was caused by the original engine overrev. Rich diagnosed bent valves and there was some leakage on the bench. However, the current symptoms are the same as before the head was removed. The original crank sensor shows some sign of contact (looks like cracking of a varnish finish). Rich swapped in a new spurious sensor, which came out with signs of contact and some steel filings attached.

[out on the bike]

Apologies coz this goes on a bit..
You've gotta get the sump off and find out where those metal particles are from. With the sump off you can rotate the crank into position with 1 + 4 bottom dead center and feel for play (movement) in the big end bearings. There is always movement side to side ie belt to flywheel but you need to check front to back. Rotate the crank again to check 2 + 3. Also using a pry bar or large screwdriver check the crank for endfloat. This is to check the thrust bearings. Place the pry bar between the middle (no 3) main cap and web of the crank and apply pressure to force the crank over. then alternate to the opposite side of the no3 cap to observe any excess play by moving the crank in the opposite direction. I have seen crank bearings brake up and thrust washers worn away but never due to being over-revved.
Good luck.

Thanks for that as it will help me check it when I take the sump off and thanks for the engine pictures partridge and sizenboots.I have looked at the pictures in the z20let reborn thread and also the ones in the balancer shaft removal guide which between them mean I now no what needs removing and how bits come off.I will hopefully get the sump off on Sunday working Saturday so hopefully I will find out the problem.Partridge thanks for the offer of the engine hoist I will give you a shout if I need it

[beginner]

Should just mention the thrust bearings i am referring to is not the clutch thrust bearing but the thrust washers that position the crank (each side lf the centre main cap if i remember correctly)