120 replies to this topic

[luna_s]

Tbh rattle or no rattle, if i ever got another one of these engines (doubt it) - i'd just change the chain for piece of mind, i hate scaremongering, but i don't want anyone to go throo what i am, chain just snapping without warning imo is dangerous (I suppose too a timing belt but they are easy to keep track of), "luckily" for me there wasn't much traffic but I was left stranded on a cold december night for quite a few hours and cost me 100 quid for recovery - (thats the price of the chain kit). IT could be other things making noises (my manifold was cracked - didnt really notice anything from that)

[benw]

I'll record a sound clip of my car when I start up this morning and post it up here this evening. Mine's 100% a manifold and I tell you, I didn't believe for one minute that's what it was at first. I posted a thread up here saying I thought my timing chain was about to go and took some persuading to come around to the idea it was the manifold.

[luna_s]

I dont disagree with the manifold issue (another flaw, possibly/probably caused by the precat), but there is still a fundamental flaw with the oil nozzle on these engines, which im assuming affects all vx220 na's, a flaw which vauxhall have subvertly agreed to with a part revision and covert documentation relating to it (in case of customer complaint aka if we can get away with it dont bother ) if id have known sooner i'd have just replaced the chain, i tend to replace cambelts on cars regardless of history - just for piece of mind for the cost of less than 20 quid and some saturday time.

[n1k_ns]

Luna, when the chain goes, does it damage the rest of the engine? Where were you when it happened? (So i can tell Vauxhall if they say no) How are you getting on with the rebuild by the way?

[slindborg]

If you are lucky and stop the engine soon enough you will lunch one cylinders worth of valves (and guides), if you are unlicky it will take all valves and guides out, possibly damage pistons, depending where the chain decides to go could take otu the balancer shaft drive etc etc etc..... my engine made the slapping at 1500-2500rpm noise, changed the chain as it was the old setup.... slapping noise went but a ticking was still there meaning my manifold is gone (awaiting mr winsters manifold ) Ive noticed the injectors like to make a racket at start up too, which then goes away after about 5 mins... prehaps they are naffed too lol. nick, its possible that if as mandarin said the bolt has sheered out that the rattle could go away with clutch depression, but that really means your mounts are naffed to bits....

[JG]

Techically we should probably all be getting our hub carrier bolts changed FOC too.

With regards to the niose on cold startup guys, i dont think i have really explained it very well at all.

Its not noticable all the time and i have only noticed it fairly recently, but the closest i can come to describing it is....

Imagine riding your push bike/bmx with your feet on the pedals keeping them still but the bike is still rolling along. (That sort of ticky/chainy/ball bearingy sound ) this is what leads me to believe that is is the cam chain. I noticed once that when i pushed the clutch down, the noise stopped.

sounds like a spigget bearing to me. Cam chains don't really make a clicky sound rather a ticking sound.

spigget bearing or release bearing only turns when you depress the clutch. its a little bearing that sits inside the flywheel that picks up the end of the imput shaft.

They wear out fairly quickly if you keep your foot on the clutch (while waiting at the lights for example)

[luna_s]

I lunched all exhaust valves and 2 inlet, the valves can compress the pistons and cause damage to the oil control rings (so new rings / possibly pistons needed - hence my choice to get rods and pistons from the states) engines going great, all ready to put in the car, just waiting on help to do that (and drag it out of my kitchen )

[nat]

Please can someone give me the number for customer services.....many thanks nat

[benw]

I tried recording my ticking manifold but frankly the recording is shite. You'd think the timing chain had broken and the sound was the valves being beaten in to the pistons!

[n1k_ns]

Update

Iv'e just had a reply from Thorney about this, they have spoken to Vauxhall about the possibility of replacing the camchain as part of a recall, but it seems that Vauxhall are not playing ball and i will have to pay for the work to be done :

(Part of the email from TMS)

I have contacted Vauxhall with regards to the camchain. This hasn’t been part of any recall on the VX220’s. The only recalls have been the vacuum hose and the alloy wheels which are only to a specific run date.

We can change the camchain but it would be on a chargeable basis.

I am going to try and either get Vaux to authorise the work to be carried out FOC, or as mentioned before; get an official letter from them stating that there is no reason for the camchain needing replacing (so if it goes bang at least i have something).

Any ideas on how best to go about this?

Thanks

N1K

Edited by n1k_ns, 19 July 2007 - 11:16 AM.

[JG]

TBH As far as i am aware its not that expensive to have the timming chain replaced (and nozzle and tentioner) Yes you might get a letter from Vauxhall saying that it is fine which will stand up when the chain breaks. But, is the stress/time/effort of knowing or not knowing if they are going to cover it, the fight you then have for them to do something about it and the time it then takes them to do it, worth it. I've just remembered something, which i had forgotten I had a new timming chain fitted under warranty as there was a ticky coming from the engine. The whole thing was replaced including tentioner and nozzle. I picked up the car on a thurday anfternoon, drove the 2.5 hours home, stuck in the garage and in the confirned space i could still the ticking. it went straight back another 2.5 hours drive and it was identified as a one of the bearings on the aux belt. this time it cost me £200, mainly in labour as the part is about £50. So i wonder if it could be that. it sounded very smiliar to me to a cam chain noise, so much so that Vaux put a new one on it.

[ChazUwe]

Remember this is not a 'Recall' it's a 'Rework' which is something that is assessed by the dealer on a case by case basis. Complain enough you might get somewhere but is it really worth the time and effort!

I know that to me I would rather pay a few hundred quid than spend hours of my free time writing letters and speaking to uninterested dealers on phone when I could be out enjoying the car!

Hope it gets sorted either way

Update

Iv'e just had a reply from Thorney about this, they have spoken to Vauxhall about the possibility of replacing the camchain as part of a recall, but it seems that Vauxhall are not playing ball and i will have to pay for the work to be done :

(Part of the email from TMS)

I have contacted Vauxhall with regards to the camchain. This hasn’t been part of any recall on the VX220’s. The only recalls have been the vacuum hose and the alloy wheels which are only to a specific run date.

We can change the camchain but it would be on a chargeable basis.

I am going to try and either get Vaux to authorise the work to be carried out FOC, or as mentioned before; get an official letter from them stating that there is no reason for the camchain needing replacing (so if it goes bang at least i have something).

Any ideas on how best to go about this?

Thanks

N1K

Edited by ChazUwe, 19 July 2007 - 11:52 AM.

[rik]

sounds silly but did you check the oil level?

[n1k_ns]

I checked it about a month ago Rik but ill check again.

TMS have just come back to me with the cost of supplying and fitting the new camchain & components:

The cost of the camchain kit is £97.50 + VAT, it will take approximately 11.5 hours to fit @ £65.00 per hour.

£747.50 + VAT

So in that respect, yeah it is worth the hassle of trying to get them to do it FOC

Edited by n1k_ns, 19 July 2007 - 02:09 PM.

[speedster]

Get a set of cams and ask your mechanic to change the t-chain during the install. Cost more but IMHO it's the best value 4 money. For £747.50 + VAT you could go do an engine maintenance course, purchase a decent tool kit and do the work yourself! After that you could make a bunch of money by servicing other ppl's VX's....

[LY_Scott]

I checked it about a month ago Rik but ill check again.

TMS have just come back to me with the cost of supplying and fitting the new camchain & components:

The cost of the camchain kit is £97.50 + VAT, it will take approximately 11.5 hours to fit @ £65.00 per hour.

£747.50 + VAT

So in that respect, yeah it is worth the hassle of trying to get them to do it FOC

hahahahaha

two words: "Second Opinion"

Let me get this right. 11.5 hours? £878 inc.vat, a timing chain? jet? and a tensioner? jesus h. maybe the type116 boys have something afterall. Get a second opinion mate. I can only assume they are taking the clam off. which by reading around is not necessary. either that or they are just simply taking the p*ss.

Scott

Edited by LY055SCO, 19 July 2007 - 02:44 PM.

[Winstar]

I checked it about a month ago Rik but ill check again.

TMS have just come back to me with the cost of supplying and fitting the new camchain & components:

The cost of the camchain kit is £97.50 + VAT, it will take approximately 11.5 hours to fit @ £65.00 per hour.

£747.50 + VAT

So in that respect, yeah it is worth the hassle of trying to get them to do it FOC

11.5 hours!!!!

It took Slindborg 8 hours having never done the job before.

Sorry, but someone taking the p1ss.

Edited by Winstar, 19 July 2007 - 02:36 PM.

[framauro]

Does anyone know what to look for (and where) to verify if this rework is already done? Is this the blob of paint thing?

[luna_s]

dealer history for the car ? - doesnt the kerridge system keep track of anything done to a vehicle ? (it did at iveco) timing chain takes about an hour when the engines out

[speedster]

This is what you end up with when the chain snaps!

CLICKY