1815 replies to this topic

[KurtVerbose]

Interesting BBC article on the Swiss perspective.

 

EU referendum: Can Switzerland show UK route to Brexit?

[LY_Scott]

Here we go...

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk...siness-35639157

[Andrew aka Stuwy]

the vote will never happen.

 

or the public will be forced into voting to stay in by some kind of clause that will make it mega expensive for the UK to leave and we the public will have to pick up the bill

 

Well fcuk.

 

Now what hat to I pic to eat

[slindborg]

maybe the clause of cost hasnt been released

[Harry Hornet]

bumpity bump...

 

..seems each side is saying the other side are liars...... no one really knows the outcome except Cameron would be shitting bricks if the OUT vote won, but then he is walking away and doing a Blair, so not his problem anyway....

 

..the migrant issue is our issue but head in the sand, stop the problem at source......The Turkish border is being opened up in October.. (albeit just to make Turkish visa's easier..wtf!)

 

 

[Crunchie]

 People who are asking for hard facts are basically asking for the future to be predicted. Last time I checked clairvoyants were a discredited bunch so not sure why the public would want to have definite answers. The only truth is that a vote for out will lead to full self determination in the traditional sense and a vote for in will lead to the UK being one of 27 other States all with supposedly equal voices, most of whom don't obey the rules that we do.

 

There is a simple Democratic deficit in the latter that I cannot see a possible solution to. 

 

Everything else is a Short to Medium Term issue that plays a subservient role to the main question hi-lighted above.

 

I hope this makes the question easier to consider

[Tfp]

I don't follow politics, never have, so haven't a clue about the in/out vote.

 

But what I can see is what's happening local to me.

 

Migrants.

 

I'm sure some of them are genuinely fleeing a warzone, but most are coming here for the housing and benefits, and many are not even from the said "warzone" hence arriving here with no passport.

 

Now I don't blame the migrants, who can blame them for wanting a better life funded by us.

 

The UK is chucking all that money at them yet us UK public are facing even more savage austerity with no sign of it ending anytime soon.

 

So my view is we should do what we have to to stop this invasion, because it can't carry on.

 

How many of them will be here in 10 years time?

 

And before anyone asks, YES, I have personal experience dealing with migrants, and I can tell you, they are NOT the type of people you'd want as your neighbour.

[slindborg]

 People who are asking for hard facts are basically asking for the future to be predicted. Last time I checked clairvoyants were a discredited bunch so not sure why the public would want to have definite answers. The only truth is that a vote for out will lead to full self determination in the traditional sense and a vote for in will lead to the UK being one of 27 other States all with supposedly equal voices, most of whom don't obey the rules that we do.   There is a simple Democratic deficit in the latter that I cannot see a possible solution to.    Everything else is a Short to Medium Term issue that plays a subservient role to the main question hi-lighted above.   I hope this makes the question easier to consider

So in short, damned if we stay and damned if we go.... Although, on the plus side, as ever, Scotland would leave our evil oppressive Union and join a far worse one In and behave like France/Span/Italy, might work well.... Ie trade and body movement but don't do any of the silly laws crap

[LY_Scott]

I don't follow politics, never have, so haven't a clue about the in/out vote.

 

But what I can see is what's happening local to me.

 

Migrants.

 

I'm sure some of them are genuinely fleeing a warzone, but most are coming here for the housing and benefits, and many are not even from the said "warzone" hence arriving here with no passport.

 

Now I don't blame the migrants, who can blame them for wanting a better life funded by us.

 

The UK is chucking all that money at them yet us UK public are facing even more savage austerity with no sign of it ending anytime soon.

 

So my view is we should do what we have to to stop this invasion, because it can't carry on.

 

How many of them will be here in 10 years time?

 

And before anyone asks, YES, I have personal experience dealing with migrants, and I can tell you, they are NOT the type of people you'd want as your neighbour.

 

that old chesnut. the shrodinger's immigrant. Coming here to be idle and claim benefits whilst also stealing your job.

 

They are just people. You should probably look up some stats on actual benefit claims from immigrants. You should also look up the amount of unclaimed benefits. You should also look up the amount of tax avoidance by corporations..You should also look up the tory's complicit nature in tax avoidance even vetoing a europe wide response....(nasty euro types!)

 

We cannot moan about immigrants/refugees whilst we encourage attacks on other countries. Have alook at how the contravestrial bombing of Syria is working out for the RAF...exactly as predicted by those opposing it. It has been a con and a failure simply done to tick the boxes of those already there making their own arse of it, not for the benefit of anyone living there or for us.

 

The world is a mess but you're targeting the symptoms. Start targeting the problems.  

[Harry Hornet]

 

I don't follow politics, never have, so haven't a clue about the in/out vote.

 

But what I can see is what's happening local to me.

 

Migrants.

 

I'm sure some of them are genuinely fleeing a warzone, but most are coming here for the housing and benefits, and many are not even from the said "warzone" hence arriving here with no passport.

 

Now I don't blame the migrants, who can blame them for wanting a better life funded by us.

 

The UK is chucking all that money at them yet us UK public are facing even more savage austerity with no sign of it ending anytime soon.

 

So my view is we should do what we have to to stop this invasion, because it can't carry on.

 

How many of them will be here in 10 years time?

 

And before anyone asks, YES, I have personal experience dealing with migrants, and I can tell you, they are NOT the type of people you'd want as your neighbour.

 

that old chesnut. the shrodinger's immigrant. Coming here to be idle and claim benefits whilst also stealing your job.

 

They are just people. You should probably look up some stats on actual benefit claims from immigrants. You should also look up the amount of unclaimed benefits. You should also look up the amount of tax avoidance by corporations..You should also look up the tory's complicit nature in tax avoidance even vetoing a europe wide response....(nasty euro types!)

 

We cannot moan about immigrants/refugees whilst we encourage attacks on other countries. Have alook at how the contravestrial bombing of Syria is working out for the RAF...exactly as predicted by those opposing it. It has been a con and a failure simply done to tick the boxes of those already there making their own arse of it, not for the benefit of anyone living there or for us.

 

The world is a mess but you're targeting the symptoms. Start targeting the problems.  

 

 

...but by staying in will it change probably not.... by getting out possibly yes,  as  who ever is in government would need to listen to the people who are (slowly) getting restless....

 

 

.. I think even the uninterested or uninitaited understand that when you do the same you get the same...how this government hasnt learnt from past mistakes beggars belief...the Middle East is and always will be a mine field that is best left alone imo...how ever far you go back in history...let the area sort is own problems out...except now the big powers want to muscle in cos of.....??oil??

 

[smiley]

 

except now the big powers want to muscle in cos of.....??oil??

 

 

 

gas.

 

Europe wants to green up, and that can only be done by changing from oil to gas. (as windmills and solar power cannot cope with demand and are way to expensive with the current technology) To bad europe does not have gas, so currently a lot comes from Russia.

 

US wants that to change, and to make the gas come from quatar, where a HUGE field was recently discovered, and is practically useless in the middle east, yet very valuable in europe.

 

Assad does not want the quatar pipeline to go through Syria, so he has to go.

 

(simplified version)

 

Edited by smiley, 08 March 2016 - 12:07 PM.

[Harry Hornet]

 

 

except now the big powers want to muscle in cos of.....??oil??

 

 

 

gas.

 

Europe wants to green up, and that can only be done by changing from oil to gas. (as windmills and solar power cannot cope with demand and are way to expensive with the current technology) To bad europe does not have gas, so currently a lot comes from Russia.

 

US wants that to change, and to make the gas come from quatar, where a HUGE field was recently discovered, and is practically useless in the middle east, yet very valuable in europe.

 

Assad does not want the quatar pipeline to go through Syria, so he has to go.

 

(simplified version)

 

 

 

ta for that..so simplified..even if we are in or out that problem will continue to exist...

 

..so what other directives / incidents would not be altered if we are in or out??..would we still have straight cumbers and bananas

 

..Also Similey..what is the general feeling in the Netherlands..In or Out ??  

[techieboy]

For the very first time in my life in regard to voting, I'm 100% undecided.

I despise almost everything the EU in it's current guise does and is aiming to do with it's infernal meddling, regulation and ever closer integration. I really would like to send a proper FU to the EU and all of it's institutions and an even larger FU to the French (government) and it's farmers after Hollande's "there will be consequences" speech.

However, I'm really worried about what it'll mean for the City and therefore the wider UK economy if we leave. Given our GDP's significant reliance on the financial services sector it's a massive risk. Especially if Paris and Frankfurt suddenly decide to aggressively pursue City institutions on the occasion of a Brexit.

As has been shown, it's effectively un-reformable unless every Tom, Dick and Harry Tomasz, Dirk and Henri agrees (and the French never will, especially if anyone dare mention CAP) so maybe I'll vote to stay and we can work to bring the whole corrupt, un-democratic, top heavy, over regulated, steaming pile of sh!t down from within.


Anyway, I think we're missing an answer to a fundamental question: Will this adversely effect Euro Trackdays/Hoons?

[smiley]

The dutch are notorious for being anti eu (as to the bunch in brussels, not to european trade coorporation)

We had a referendum in 2005, in wich we voted against. Some lines in the treaty were changed, and the bill passed without a new referndum.

After that the trust in democracy was lost.

 

Our latest election polls show large numbers for the anti EU party, comparable to what's going on in other countries.

 

Our country is to small to walk out on it's own and face the music. (trade is heavily interlinked with Germany)

We would need a bigger country to break the current Brussels trend of more EU to fix everything.

 

[siztenboots]

Greece, Ireland, Portugal were all proof that EU is just another Ponzi scheme.

[christhegasman]

I don't follow politics, never have, so haven't a clue about the in/out vote.   But what I can see is what's happening local to me.   Migrants.   I'm sure some of them are genuinely fleeing a warzone, but most are coming here for the housing and benefits, and many are not even from the said "warzone" hence arriving here with no passport.   Now I don't blame the migrants, who can blame them for wanting a better life funded by us.   The UK is chucking all that money at them yet us UK public are facing even more savage austerity with no sign of it ending anytime soon.   So my view is we should do what we have to to stop this invasion, because it can't carry on.   How many of them will be here in 10 years time?   And before anyone asks, YES, I have personal experience dealing with migrants, and I can tell you, they are NOT the type of people you'd want as your neighbour.

  that old chesnut. the shrodinger's immigrant. Coming here to be idle and claim benefits whilst also stealing your job.   They are just people. You should probably look up some stats on actual benefit claims from immigrants. You should also look up the amount of unclaimed benefits. You should also look up the amount of tax avoidance by corporations..You should also look up the tory's complicit nature in tax avoidance even vetoing a europe wide response....(nasty euro types!)   We cannot moan about immigrants/refugees whilst we encourage attacks on other countries. Have alook at how the contravestrial bombing of Syria is working out for the RAF...exactly as predicted by those opposing it. It has been a con and a failure simply done to tick the boxes of those already there making their own arse of it, not for the benefit of anyone living there or for us.   The world is a mess but you're targeting the symptoms. Start targeting the problems.  

and you should come and live in a multicultural sh*t hole and feel the real world where you feel intimidated in your own country by gangs of migrants and fear for the safety of your kids now they are old enough to go out at night but are harassed by the same migrants Sorry mate out out out for me I dare say that if Britain chooses to leave you privileged north of the border guys can have another referendum look after yourselves join the European then have as many migrants as you want Sorry if this sounds harsh but I am sick of people who are not overrun by migrants saying how good they are for the country

Edited by christhegasman, 08 March 2016 - 01:47 PM.

[slindborg]

And thats the thing that confuses me lots... Why would Scotland not want to be "run" by London, yet be happy to be "run" by Brussles at MASSIVE cost?

Or have I missed something?

[christhegasman]

And thats the thing that confuses me lots... Why would Scotland not want to be "run" by London, yet be happy to be "run" by Brussles at MASSIVE cost? Or have I missed something?

👍🏻

[Craig S]

And thats the thing that confuses me lots... Why would Scotland not want to be "run" by London, yet be happy to be "run" by Brussles at MASSIVE cost?

Or have I missed something?

 

Confused me too 

[Raptor]

And thats the thing that confuses me lots... Why would Scotland not want to be "run" by London, yet be happy to be "run" by Brussles at MASSIVE cost?

Or have I missed something?

 

because when Scotland eventually does decide to leave the UK (after equally being mis-informed about pros and cons), they can at least get a bail out/subsidies from the EU..