1815 replies to this topic

[C8RKH]

I would not say a chip on the shoulder at all. Scotland might have a positive balance of payments on trade, however, the overall budget for Scotland is still in deficit so if independent where does that shortfall get covered? Currently, the risk and issue lies with the UK as a whole, as opposed to a specific region in the UK.

 

But then, those with a chip on their shoulder who see no good in Scotland being a part of the UK don't always want to look at the whole picture, just the bits that support their view.  it cuts both ways basically whether you're pro or agin' independence for Scotland. Same goes for pro or agin' Brexit.

 

As for trade deals, we have a commonwealth that wants to trade with us but we cannot set up trade deals with as the EU wants to protect it's own bargainings and companies - the EU is quite protectionist in reality, hardly conducive to open trade which is why it takes them so long to create trade deals and why many stall before they get there.

 

 

 

[LY_Scott]

Aye the common wealth. I look forward to our great trade deal with Malawi. Rule Brittania!

 

Can you lay it out for us what the benefit of these mystical trade deals with the commonwealth countries will be over what we have already other than it makes you feel fuzzy inside?

 

Picking out a single year or two in the history of a country to define its economy is naive if nothing else. But well done you for spouting that party line of how well the union works for Scotland....

[LY_Scott]

 

I do love the greivance argument from yoons who have that massive chip on their shoulder about anything with a slant of Independence for Scotland.

 

We can roll back to 2014 if we like and remind ourselves Scotland has a positive balance of payments in trade, the UK overall doesn't.....

 

Being in the EU isn't just about trading within it either. The EU has negociated trade deals globally for it's members. The SWA hailing the recent trade deals with the far east which meant a reduction from 45% tarrifs to 0%...

 

Not sure if I'm one of these said 'yoons' (not sure what they means tbh), but if you'd care to explain the logic behind the current approach to Sturgeon's EU approach, we're all ears..

 

The balance of payments comments - what is the long term trend for this? I'll think you'll find its a similar profile to the UK overall. 2014 is also fairly selective as that the last year before offshore Oil&Gas related trade would have started to plummet - I know as I work in it, and overall 'trade' from this sector must be down 25% easily as producers and those with large purchasing power has massively reduced their spend profiles in order to meet cost reduction targets.

 

Yep, the Scottish Government has had loads of recent success in trade deals with large, communist far-eastern countries..  Anyway, nothing you've noted with regards to international trade deals isn't achievable outwith the EU. Although the benefits of trade was the primary benefit of remaining in the EU.  

 

 

Can you tell us what Norway's take in Oil and Gas was last year? Can you tell us what it lets us know about the mismanagement of the resource in the UK. Thanks.

 

Yoons, unionists.

 

No Ross. The EU has.

 

I'm not Surgeon's spokesperson. She's more capable than either of us to know her own mind on matters. At my best guess we have indyref2 consoltation to end January 11th, A yes conference January 14th, A supreme court ruling anythime soon and Article 50 sometime before the end of March to see where we end up.

 

[Rosssco]

 

 

I do love the greivance argument from yoons who have that massive chip on their shoulder about anything with a slant of Independence for Scotland.

 

We can roll back to 2014 if we like and remind ourselves Scotland has a positive balance of payments in trade, the UK overall doesn't.....

 

Being in the EU isn't just about trading within it either. The EU has negociated trade deals globally for it's members. The SWA hailing the recent trade deals with the far east which meant a reduction from 45% tarrifs to 0%...

 

Not sure if I'm one of these said 'yoons' (not sure what they means tbh), but if you'd care to explain the logic behind the current approach to Sturgeon's EU approach, we're all ears..

 

The balance of payments comments - what is the long term trend for this? I'll think you'll find its a similar profile to the UK overall. 2014 is also fairly selective as that the last year before offshore Oil&Gas related trade would have started to plummet - I know as I work in it, and overall 'trade' from this sector must be down 25% easily as producers and those with large purchasing power has massively reduced their spend profiles in order to meet cost reduction targets.

 

Yep, the Scottish Government has had loads of recent success in trade deals with large, communist far-eastern countries..  Anyway, nothing you've noted with regards to international trade deals isn't achievable outwith the EU. Although the benefits of trade was the primary benefit of remaining in the EU.  

 

 

Can you tell us what Norway's take in Oil and Gas was last year? Can you tell us what it lets us know about the mismanagement of the resource in the UK. Thanks.

 

Yoons, unionists.

 

No Ross. The EU has.

 

I'm not Surgeon's spokesperson. She's more capable than either of us to know her own mind on matters. At my best guess we have indyref2 consoltation to end January 11th, A yes conference January 14th, A supreme court ruling anythime soon and Article 50 sometime before the end of March to see where we end up.

 

 

 

Ah, the usual "whoosh parrot don't answer a question but ask a slightly relevant sounding, but actually irrelevant to the actual topic, question in response.." I don't know what Norway made in direct government income from offshore producer tax last year.. I know its significantly less than previous years, to the extent there is a lot of gov. budget revision ongoing. I'm sure they made more than -£100million in revenue though... What this has to do with trade with the EU / outside the EU, and Scotland, I'm not sure TBH...  

 

Sturgeon know's the indyref2 game is dead for now, with falling support and no real appetite for a rerun from the majority. I'm sure the spin-masters at SNP HQ will come up with something to prove this isn't the case however and keep the tartan faithful motivated   So she will flog the Brexit case as much as possible to produce as much political discourse as possible, which is the point I was making previously.

 

Don't get me wrong, I've never supported Brexit, but it was a democratic vote that went a certain way, its just Nats like your good self are not really too fond of democracy when it doesn't go your way (e.g. Indyref2 and fantasy separate Brexit deal)..

 

 

Edited by Rosssco, 05 January 2017 - 12:14 PM.

[Rosssco]

Aye the common wealth. I look forward to our great trade deal with Malawi. Rule Brittania!

 

Can you lay it out for us what the benefit of these mystical trade deals with the commonwealth countries will be over what we have already other than it makes you feel fuzzy inside?

 

Picking out a single year or two in the history of a country to define its economy is naive if nothing else. But well done you for spouting that party line of how well the union works for Scotland....

 

Yep, best to ignore the small economies of Canada, Australia, NZ, Singapore, India etc. and focus on a small Africa state

 

It's telling when you can be relentlessly and overly optimistic about the opportunities and benefits for a 'Free' Scotland away from its main trading / cultural / family / historic partner, but hopelessly pessimistic about the world's 6th largest economy once removed from some of the restrictions associated in trading within a large economic block of very economically / culturally diverse countries..  

[Harry Hornet]

...so 498 vs 114....

 

..seems the Scots need to look for that elusive  goalkeeper ...

 

 

..let the fun begin....

[chickendippers]

Oh god, that Sturgeon bint will be banging on about a second referendum to leave the UK again. If she hates the UK so much why doesnt she just p*ss off somewhere else?!

[LY_Scott]

.

Edited by LY_Scott, 16 March 2017 - 11:31 AM.

[LY_Scott]

I see the Dutch saw sense and have shown their fluffy haired right winger a set of Vs with pro euro parties seeing gains We now need the French to see sense too, they will. I look forward to the look on the faces of Farage and Trump as their projections of an EU collapse on the back of their right wing pals falls to pieces.

Edited by LY_Scott, 16 March 2017 - 11:32 AM.

[chickendippers]

I see the Dutch saw sense and have shown their fluffy haired right winger a set of Vs with pro euro parties seeing gains We now need the French to see sense too, they will. I look forward to the look on the faces of Farage and Trump as their projections of an EU collapse on the back of their right wing pals falls to pieces.

 

The Freedom party still gained an extra 5 seats though and hold the second highest amount so I don't think it's going to be the last we hear from Wilders

[Rosssco]

I agree Scott, but worryingly these ultra-right wing parties while not gaining control, have clawed themselves into significant positions of power and influence, something that would have been un-thought of 5 - 10 years ago..

 

As with UKIP, we can see what a party with this level of influence (but without parliamentary power) can do to affect sentiment - it forces 'main stream' parties to move to move away for the center ground to confront the typically simplistic arguments put forward by many of the ultra right-wing parties, and become either more right-wing (Tories) or Left-wing (Labour), which ultimately serves to isolate and reduce their appeal to the largest demographic..

 

You'll see this process continue throughout the EU, as in some ways, many of the Euro countries are more susceptible to this kind of influence than the UK is.. (IMO)

[siztenboots]

can we scrap the Barnett formula now then?

[LY_Scott]

I agree Scott, but worryingly these ultra-right wing parties while not gaining control, have clawed themselves into significant positions of power and influence, something that would have been un-thought of 5 - 10 years ago..   As with UKIP, we can see what a party with this level of influence (but without parliamentary power) can do to affect sentiment - it forces 'main stream' parties to move to move away for the center ground to confront the typically simplistic arguments put forward by many of the ultra right-wing parties, and become either more right-wing (Tories) or Left-wing (Labour), which ultimately serves to isolate and reduce their appeal to the largest demographic..   You'll see this process continue throughout the EU, as in some ways, many of the Euro countries are more susceptible to this kind of influence than the UK is.. (IMO)

Aye, I can agree with most of that. I would hope the remainder of the EU can hold itself together and I think it will. I see Trump and his minions have also calmed down the rhetoric on the EU. It was borne out of the best of intentions and is on the whole a force for good. Individuals like Juncker don't help it with his quoted remarks the other day regards Brexit. But we must bear in mind these individuals like all of us are temporary. We must see the big picture.

[LY_Scott]

can we scrap the Barnett formula now then?

Certainly. If all the tax collected in Scotland can be managed by the Scottish Parliament at our pleasure and we can stop our "service payments" to westminster also

[C8RKH]

How does the service payments work? Is that the reason why Scotland has the largest budget deficit of any country in the EU and nearly twice that of the UK?

[Rosssco]

How does the service payments work? Is that the reason why Scotland has the largest budget deficit of any country in the EU and nearly twice that of the UK?

 

Good luck with that..  

[Harry Hornet]

..well thats us all fecked then..... 

[hairy]

[C8RKH]

I see the Dutch saw sense and have shown their fluffy haired right winger a set of Vs with pro euro parties seeing gains We now need the French to see sense too, they will. I look forward to the look on the faces of Farage and Trump as their projections of an EU collapse on the back of their right wing pals falls to pieces.

 

Why should they. They will just do what the SNP has been doing for the past 2 years - whinge and whine and moan and bitch until they get another vote that hopefully will go their way. And it when it doesn't. Well, rinse and repeat! I knew our life expectancy in Scotland had gotten' really bad, but a generation is now onl;y 2 years it seems. Great stuff

[WrightStuff]

I see the Dutch saw sense and have shown their fluffy haired right winger a set of Vs with pro euro parties seeing gains We now need the French to see sense too, they will. I look forward to the look on the faces of Farage and Trump as their projections of an EU collapse on the back of their right wing pals falls to pieces.

 

Rutte won with 33 seats, Wilders 2nd with 20 seats.

In the 2012 election Wilders finished 3rd with 15 seats.

 

Its clear the direction that public opinion is going. It has just not quite reached breaking point yet, but probably will have by the next election. This is just putting off a problem which is being ignored and is getting worse, and by the time the next election comes round perhaps the Dutch will be so cheesed off that they will vote for a real right wing nutter.

 

I wouldn't write off Le Pen. All the (main stream media) polls told us vote leave and trump wouldn't win too.