79 replies to this topic

[JG]

on the road there is little difference between the two...

YES, also on the road there IS a LOT of difference! I tested both, NA and Turbo before I bought the turbo, both by road and on track.

The turbo is brutal, and definately faster than the NA!

There are peeps here that have owned both over a significant amount of time, and have concluded that the VXT 'feels' faster but isnt really on Uk roads (whilst keeping to speed limits)

I think that was what JG was alluding to

ding

The fact is up to 100mph or so there really is little in it. I would say that even if speed limits weren't taken into account there would be little in it on Uk roads. Too many corners, too rougher surface, too many variables. Might be different on the continent, where the roads feel wider and smoother and where full throttle is used more of the time.

TT will confirm that even in a stage 1 VXT, he rarely pulls much much more than a car length or 2, even on dual caridge way (up to as i said above: 100mph or so) after that the VXT streches its legs and will comfortably pull away.

I'm not entering the debate BTW

[garyk220]

Hmmm. My stage 2 VXT left a modified Sport 160 and standard VXTs trailing on a run in the Borders. Speeds were capped at 90 leptons (trying to be fairly sensible) so the top end advantage in speed wasn't used, but even on a twisty 3rd gear road the extra grunt in the turbo made a massive different to the speed over the ground. The Elise driver's comments when we parked up... "wow!... I've never driven that road as quick as that before". We were parked for 3 or 4 minutes before the standard 1.8 Elises finally rolled into the parking area. I've owned both NA and turbo, and even with the extra weight at the back, my turbo has better rear grip (better weight distribution) and is less understeery on the limit than my old NA. Admittedly the turbo understeers initially at fairly low corners speeds, but if you learn to drive beyond that and trust that the back end will grip (it took me a few track days to find the extra grip, and trust it) the corner speeds are higher. Not by much admittedly, but enough to make a difference on a twisty road. Both great cars btw. Just mine is better

[djegiant]

on the road there is little difference between the two...

YES, also on the road there IS a LOT of difference! I tested both, NA and Turbo before I bought the turbo, both by road and on track.

The turbo is brutal, and definately faster than the NA!

The turbo is not brutal!

After coming from the world of superbikes, and after hearing rave reviews on the VXT I was expecting "brutal" myself! I found the VXT to be only slightly less than the NA!

NA swung it for me with the way it feels!
Oh and price, because im not a £,£££,£££aire!

TBH I think the whole Tubby vs NA debate is b*ll*cks!
Its all down to driver ability at the end of the day and you should buy whichever one makes you smile!

All IMO of course!

Edited by djegiant, 27 March 2006 - 10:21 AM.

[Purebob]

Craigs182, what do you mean by "major" ? The NA will feel a bit quicker than a Clio 182 up to about 90 then feel slower to max speed. The Turbo will feel a good bit quicker than a clio 182 up to about 120 then the clio will feel quicker. Neither VX engine is very charismatic unmodfied, not so eager as a Clio 182 for example ! What the VXT will do is make any great hot hatch feel like you're driving on wobbly stilts wearing boxing gloves: the NA slightly moreso IME. I prefer the NA as it handles a bit sharper and I like being able to thrash the engine in hard road driving, though I loved the grunty acceleration of the VXT. You need to drive 'em and see which you prefer. BTW I'd LOVE to be able to put teh renaultsport 182 lump in an NA VX, its a much harder revving and eager lump than either the VX's or VXTs engine IME !

[paulr]

The fact is up to 100mph or so there really is little in it. I would say that even if speed limits weren't taken into account there would be little in it on Uk roads. Too many corners, too rougher surface, too many variables. Might be different on the continent, where the roads feel wider and smoother and where full throttle is used more of the time.

My experience so far of the VXT doesn't give me the feeling they are that close.

I've had my VXT for 3 months now and I had an N\A for 3 years (then I year VX free).

I initially looked at getting the VXT the first year of having the NA but decided that the 10k extra just wasn't worth the difference I felt.

I can't argue that the 0-60 feels very close, but where the NA appeared to loose the grunt over 70ish, the VXT keeps pulling so much stronger.

The NA was initailly quicker than a civic type-R but would get over taken if I kept on accelerating.

I know 0-60 or 0-100 isn't everything, but as an indication what are the 0-100mph for the NA, I can find times for the VXT ?

[Purebob]

Yep, I think the NA hits a wall at 80-ish, and 'ordinary' cars can haul one in after that point. VX carries on pulling hard at least thirty miles an hour longer IME. Takes a GOOD long run to hit 130 plus IME, my Mrs' old 200SX is quicker over a ton than my vx. Unimportant to me however, as I rarely drive over a ton, and LOVE the unhesitant sprightliness under that speed !

[Jase_MK]

Results from the mini sprint at the National meet last year 1st place - NA 2nd place - VXR 3rd place - tuned VXT 4th+ - lots of NAs, VXTs, VXRs.... Admittedly that was only up to speeds of around 55mph but most of the fun to be had in a VX is up to and around that kind of speed anyway. In other words, get whatever you prefer the feel of as nothing is going walk all other anything else when it comes to VX variants.

[AndyB]

on the road there is little difference between the two...

Unless it is a long straight road where the turbo would p*ss all over the NA hands down. And no-one can really argue about that.

[gherkins]

Wot abot shoving a scooby engine in? It's a boxer so weight lower. And such possibilities for tuning. Bet it's not possible though!

[RWinstanley]

I'm not really entering into the NA vs Turbo performance debate. but to pick up a point on the Clio 182 engine it revs harder and performs better because it's a performance derivative that was re-engineered specifically for that purpose. With if it's anything like the 206 180 engine, specific head castings, pistons and cams. Where as the engines in the NA is stright out of a Vectra designed for low speed torque and at the expense of high speed power. The Turbo engine on the other hand comes from a performace derivative of the Astra, although an older design, so should perform better. This is because for such small production numbers an engine redsign is not finacially viable. Oh and i find my NA runs out of steam when you change to 4th gear, at about 80 leapton Rob

[bren.wright]

Most people buy the NA because they cannot justify spending the extra on the turbo. Put both cars on a track like Silverstone with the same driver and the turbo will maul the NA, no question.

[chuno]

Most people buy the NA because they cannot justify spending the extra on the turbo.

[djegiant]

Put both cars on a track like Silverstone with the same driver and the turbo will maul the NA, no question.   

Because F1 tracks are certainly where I spend most of my time driving!

Meanwhile in the real world, who cares!

If you were bullied in school and feel you need speed to make up for a small manhood- just buy a turbo and enjoy that instant macho feeling! If you are a more balanced individual (or skint like myself! ) and just want some pure driving fun get an NA!

[bren.wright]

Just trying to stop people deluding themselves into thinking the NA is as fast as the turbo when it clearly is not!

[JG]

Most people buy the NA because they cannot justify spending the extra on the turbo. Put both cars on a track like Silverstone with the same driver and the turbo will maul the NA, no question.

[djegiant]

Just trying to stop people deluding themselves into thinking the NA is as fast as the turbo when it clearly is not!

[CocoPops]

Put both cars on a track like Silverstone with the same driver and the turbo will maul the NA, no question.

Whatever!!!

I'd like to see you drive the VXT and NA on the roads the same as you would around silverstone!

[Amoger]

Lol I know "NA vs Tubby" kicks off at least once a month, but it always produces some classic posts... I'd just like to add: GO TUBBIES!

[bren.wright]

I have never been involved in one of these posts before so I thought I would do this one lmao! It's like every other forum you go on, on Scoobynet people with WRX's think they are better than STI's and so on... I can drive round local roads like Silverstone, after all I am a professional racing driver!

[chuno]

I can drive round local roads like Silverstone, after all I am a professional racing driver!

Public road restrictions don't apply to racing drivers then?