92 replies to this topic

[lozcs]

Why would you change a GT2 for Celica.

OMG - you are right SPLAM!

I'm canceling my order....

Lawrence......

[Jim_Cross]

Dave, how come he changes the cars so regularly? Surely to get anything out of a GT2, 360 etc you need to do quite a lot of miles to learn about the car and start extracting more from it. Certainly after 6k miles and 11 months with the VX I'm still learning with every drive. I bet in 500 miles he hasn't even worked out what half the buttons do

[davehutchinson]

He buys what he wants and its very easy to tell the character of a car within a couple of minutes. The GT2 was too "boring" for him apparantly, it lacked any character and was pretty non descript. My Dad is also an exceptional driver with a lot of experience of F1 cars, hill climbing etc which he did in his spare time a couple of years ago so he can get a feel for these things pretty quickly. At the end of the day though I feel a lot of people miss the point of supercars, the differences are minor, so minor you wouldn't be able to tell and it's rather academic which is 0.1s quicker to 60 or 100. When you spend that kind of cash, you buy what you want not what's slightly faster on paper. For arguments sake though, I've just discovered that the Gallardo is faster in the 1/4 mile than both the Murcielago and the GT2.

[wickywire]

I hate splam I reckon the Gallardo is a beautiful machine but i've just seen 3 celicas and they do resemble a Gallardo shape wise. If you put a scoop on the front of a Gallardo then the bonnet woulod be the same. I'd still have one though

[Purebob]

I feel a lot of people miss the point of supercars, the differences are minor, so minor you wouldn't be able to tell

I utterly, completely disagree.

I've not had the benefit of your unusual familarity with current supercars but I've tracked a 360 a 355 and a Diablo, and driven a 550 maranello, several 993/996s and a few other very very quick cars, and I could tell within 100m and the first corner blindfolded which was which. The communication, cornering attitude and engine nature is very different on all of these cars.

The only part I agree with is that: "it's rather academic which is 0.1s quicker to 60 or 100". The raw aceleration can be matched or bettered by many more mortal cars these days, its the nature of a great supercar that is so intoxicating, not the accelerationIME.

Unless you race them, the performance figure differences of monstrously fast cars are only ever useful in pub arguments IMO.

[davehutchinson]

That's not quite what I meant. I was referring to it mainly in the light of performance differences and the also the fact that they are all incredibly good cars. You don't always buy a supercar on the premise of its handling or its engine since they're all so good at what they do. It comes down to preference rather than each individual car's capabilities. Of course all the cars are different, I could easily tell the difference in balance/handling/engine from all the cars I've driven so don't worry, I didn't mean that literally

[SPLAM]

I hate splam I'd still have one though

[da_murphster]

He lost £20k on the GT2 in 3 months and 500 miles

I cant help but feel my heckles rise when people throw away money like that. I loose sleep when I have to cough up a couple of hundred quid!!!

But then again I am a miser who attempt to live a lifestyle well above my income allows!!

Did you know that UK, Germany and US account for 79% of all supercar sales? I'd attatch the artical but never have worked out how to do it!

[Purebob]

Dave if thats not what you meant, why did you say it so clearly ?

I You were very clear :

the differences are minor, so minor you wouldn't be able to tell

In your reply here you completely change what you meant :

Of course all the cars are different,I could easily tell the difference

[davehutchinson]

I didn't specify the differences. You know how many cars I've driven and you also know from your own experience that they are different, therefore you should assume that I didn't mean they were all the same and impossible to tell apart! At the end of the day I'm not going to make a comment that's completely wrong, nor do I want to start an arguement over anything so small. Apologies if I came across differently to how I meant it.

Edited by davehutchinson, 03 May 2004 - 02:56 PM.

[Purebob]

You dismissed the differences as being

... minor, so minor you wouldn't be able to tell 

Dave I have no idea how many cars you've driven. I have seen only different new expensive cars on the same drive in photographs. All I know is that you regularly state one thing very clearly then change your mind over the duration of a thread, such as here and in the PVD thread recently.

But it doesn't really matter. In summary your Dad sees fit to p*ss tens of thousands of pounds up the wall on a whim, and it means you get to drive lots of nice cars, albeit not run in.

Congrats etc.

[andym172]

In summary your Dad sees fit to p*ss tens of thousands of pounds up the wall on a whim, and it means you get to drive lots of nice cars, albeit not run in.

Congrats etc.

That's a bit of a harsh comment PB - if Dave's dad wants to spend his money in this way, then who are you to comment on it?!

[Purebob]

Andy, Dave made some comments that conflicted with themselves and which contained inferences I disagreed with so I commented. However much an aspirant capitalist you may be Andy, you must accept that some of us will always comment that to burn hundred pound notes as a hobby in a world of need is not a nice thing to do. It is anyone's right to spend money as they see fit, and it is the right of onlookers to comment. And I still wouldn't spend that money on a Gallardo Fundamentally I object to Dave telling me that theres no difference between supercars, as I wouldn't be able to detect them. I'm not good at being patronised.

Edited by Purebob, 03 May 2004 - 06:00 PM.

[Sicey]

Nice car Dave Your Pa is a lucky man(he's earned it) and you are a lucky boy to have the pleasure of all these toys. Am I just a teeny weeny bit jealous, you bet I am , where did I put that winning lotto ticket

[davehutchinson]

Fundamentally I object to Dave telling me that theres no difference between supercars, as I wouldn't be able to detect them.  I'm not good at being patronised.

PB I don't quite understand why you wish to argue or be such a pedant about it. Do you take me for a total idiot? I would never say "all supercars are the same" and mean that they all handle the same, they all drive the same. I merely meant it exactly how everyone else interpreted it, they're all exceptional at what they do, the differences in actual performance be it handling or power are small and therefore not that greater influence on purchasing such a car as say it is when we look at the VX compared to other cars in its price range. In the price range of the VX there's nothing which can compete for driver feel and such an appreciative sense of ownership that you and others share. Supercars in that kind of bracket are all so good, it's like splitting hairs. I haven't backtracked, nor conflicted with previous comments, you just interpreted it too literally. Now please can we stop this rather inane discussion and get back to a friendly atmosphere

Edit : Just to confirm, those who have met me in real life will realise I'm a very honest and genuine person who bears no grudges at all, I never try to offend anyone be it intentional or not, therefore PB the last thing I would ever try and do is to patronise you as it's not in my nature at all.

Edited by davehutchinson, 03 May 2004 - 06:07 PM.

[andym172]

Andy, Dave made some comments that conflicted with themselves and which contained inferences I disagreed with so I commented.

However much an aspirant capitalist you may be Andy, you must accept that some of us will always comment that to burn hundred pound notes as a hobby in a world of need is not a nice thing to do. It is anyone's right to spend money as they see fit, and it is the right of onlookers to comment.

And I still wouldn't spend that money on a Gallardo 

Fundamentally I object to Dave telling me that theres no difference between supercars, as I wouldn't be able to detect them.  I'm not good at being patronised.

This isn't yet more tripe about carrying a lot of working class guilt is it PB?

It's Mr Hutchinson Snr's right to do whatever he likes with his money in my opinion. If he wants to 'p*ss it up the wall' then good luck to him! I'm behind him all the way...

And what's all this "some of us will always comment that to burn hundred pound notes as a hobby in a world of need is not a nice thing to do"? Have you not spent £20k+ in full knowledge that you're going to lose quite a few thousands of pounds in depreciation on doing exactly the same thing?

It's not as if he's driving around trying to run little kids over, he's simply spending money on something he loves.

Nothing wrong with that in my opinion - the aspirant capitalist that I am...

[andym172]

Edit : Just to confirm, those who have met me in real life will realise I'm a very honest and genuine person who bears no grudges at all, I never try to offend anyone be it intentional or not, therefore PB the last thing I would ever try and do is to patronise you as it's not in my nature at all.

Don't believe him - I found him to be a total prat!

[Jim_Cross]

Dave, I think I should drive each of your Dad's new cars before determining for myself how similar they really are in terms of handling and power. While I can accept that say a 360 CS and 911 GT3 are similar in feel, I would expect a Gallardo to feel quite different. A 360 Spider should certainly feel different to a GT2, with the Porsche being much faster, and very tricky. I think what you're trying to say is that with supercars, a lot of the buying decision is about emotion and character, and I'd still argue that you can't get to the bottom of a car's character in 500 miles. And why the hell hasn't he got a 360 CS yet?!

[davehutchinson]

He just didn't hit it off with the GT2, he felt it was a mistake almost as soon as he bought it. You know what cars are like when they're gleaming in the showroom. The GT2 didn't have any noise, it did everything "as you'd expect " it to, no real character and a bit focussed. Lambo's do have character in a similar way to the VX I suppose.

[Louise]

Why would you change a GT2 for Celica.

That aint no Celica matey

You're a lucky, lucky boy Dave