388 replies to this topic

[1cobrav8]

Below is the curve with the new fuel pump fitted and a little work done to the map over laid with the first initial pull.. IAT was rising massively during pulls which I believe is whats causing the big drop in power at the top end. 

 

 

 

[1cobrav8]

A picture that I received yesterday of the WI tank i'm having made, wasn't finished at this point but it gives you an idea. Should arrive with me tomorrow. 

 

[CHILL Gone DUTCH]

This dip top end is nothing unusual on our sc cars emanta and smiley are trying to get to the bottom of why it's happening

[CHILL Gone DUTCH]

Will be intresting to see if it's still there when water injection is fitted

[1cobrav8]

Will be intresting to see if it's still there when water injection is fitted

I don't think it will be. No Mechanical reason for it to do it, boost is still constant so as long as the IAT's are constant so ignition retard/knock isn't present the power should continue to climb. 

 

Can you adjust the Air Temp Correction in the OBD Tuner Software? 

[1cobrav8]

Another picture of the now completed WI tank

 

[CHILL Gone DUTCH]

Will be intresting to see if it's still there when water injection is fitted

I don't think it will be. No Mechanical reason for it to do it, boost is still constant so as long as the IAT's are constant so ignition retard/knock isn't present the power should continue to climb.    Can you adjust the Air Temp Correction in the OBD Tuner Software? 

Yes But be warned them features are there for a reason

[1cobrav8]

 

 

Will be intresting to see if it's still there when water injection is fitted

I don't think it will be. No Mechanical reason for it to do it, boost is still constant so as long as the IAT's are constant so ignition retard/knock isn't present the power should continue to climb.    Can you adjust the Air Temp Correction in the OBD Tuner Software? 

Yes But be warned them features are there for a reason

 

I Understand that, just interested to see how much ignition is rolled of at those temps

[CHILL Gone DUTCH]

Do a Obd power run and look at the AFR Fuel is added at higher temps And check the ignition compared to tables

[CHILL Gone DUTCH]

You can also do this with logging session by clicking on a Pacific time which will but cross hatches in the tables

[Exmantaa]

 

Will be intresting to see if it's still there when water injection is fitted

I don't think it will be. No Mechanical reason for it to do it, boost is still constant so as long as the IAT's are constant so ignition retard/knock isn't present the power should continue to climb. 

 

Can you adjust the Air Temp Correction in the OBD Tuner Software? 

 

 

You have the typical ~6600 rpm "OBD powerdip", although your dip is not as brutal as other SC's that dive of a cliff there...

(what value/paramters are the yellow and grey line in the bottom part? I assumed Lambda? Did you alter timing for the 2nd higher torque measurement?)

 

In OBD you can adjust the fuelling related to intake temps, but there are more temperature related tables that we have no access too with the current OBD client software. As you say the data indicate that there is no mechanical reason the power should drop at that rpm. (Although 115KPa at 50°C is not the same air amount as 115KPa at 90°C...)

 

We think it's maybe related to (another IAT) safety feature in the ecu playing up, but then I think you should see that in the ignition advance. (if the logged IGN value is indeed the actual commanded ignition timing...)

Only mechanical limitations I can think of are maybe valve spring issues. (but would show up in the MAP log value) Or it has something to do with failing ignition/spark at higher boost/rpms... 

[techieboy]

Another picture of the now completed WI tank

 

 

Looks good and better yet, looks like it might still be possible to get it to work on the passenger side of the car which is where I want to fit one. Any baffling inside the tank to stop it slopping about? 

[1cobrav8]

 

Another picture of the now completed WI tank

 

 

Looks good and better yet, looks like it might still be possible to get it to work on the passenger side of the car which is where I want to fit one. Any baffling inside the tank to stop it slopping about? 

 

Yes there's a vertical baffle on the opposite side to the filler. 

[1cobrav8]

 

 

Will be intresting to see if it's still there when water injection is fitted

I don't think it will be. No Mechanical reason for it to do it, boost is still constant so as long as the IAT's are constant so ignition retard/knock isn't present the power should continue to climb. 

 

Can you adjust the Air Temp Correction in the OBD Tuner Software? 

 

 

You have the typical ~6600 rpm "OBD powerdip", although your dip is not as brutal as other SC's that dive of a cliff there...

(what value/paramters are the yellow and grey line in the bottom part? I assumed Lambda? Did you alter timing for the 2nd higher torque measurement?)

 

In OBD you can adjust the fuelling related to intake temps, but there are more temperature related tables that we have no access too with the current OBD client software. As you say the data indicate that there is no mechanical reason the power should drop at that rpm. (Although 115KPa at 50°C is not the same air amount as 115KPa at 90°C...)

 

We think it's maybe related to (another IAT) safety feature in the ecu playing up, but then I think you should see that in the ignition advance. (if the logged IGN value is indeed the actual commanded ignition timing...)

Only mechanical limitations I can think of are maybe valve spring issues. (but would show up in the MAP log value) Or it has something to do with failing ignition/spark at higher boost/rpms... 

 

Yellow and grey are indeed Lambda figures, you can see the yellow one going of lean when i still just had the stock fuel pump fitted. 

 

I'm hoping that the pro software will give us more access to these parameters so we can really see whats going on. I plan now to map the car on the road and then place it on the rollers again to do another pull. 

[Exmantaa]

 

Yellow and grey are indeed Lambda figures, you can see the yellow one going of lean when i still just had the stock fuel pump fitted. 

 

I'm hoping that the pro software will give us more access to these parameters so we can really see whats going on. I plan now to map the car on the road and then place it on the rollers again to do another pull. 

 

 

Thought so, but could not work out the scale of the yellow/grey line.

(grey mow indicates "0.4" value?

[1cobrav8]

 

 

Yellow and grey are indeed Lambda figures, you can see the yellow one going of lean when i still just had the stock fuel pump fitted. 

 

I'm hoping that the pro software will give us more access to these parameters so we can really see whats going on. I plan now to map the car on the road and then place it on the rollers again to do another pull. 

 

 

Thought so, but could not work out the scale of the yellow/grey line.

(grey mow indicates "0.4" value?

 

Scaling on the left is for boost pressure(BAR). The lambda is running at about 0.8 from about 5250rpm onwards

[smiley]

 

Can you adjust the Air Temp Correction in the OBD Tuner Software? 

 

 

Not as a feature yet (scheduled for obdtuner pro, somewhere in the future)

For now you can send your map to Peter, who will then up the starting to 80 degree, instead of 60.

Without that, the ecu will:

 

60C - 0,0 degree retard 65C - 0,5 degree retard 70C - 1,0 degree retard 75C - 1,5 degree retard 80C - 2,0 degree retard

 

With my M62/3" pully i get up to 75 degree on track. With my harrop/3.14" pully i get up to 95 degree on track.

 

 

Edited by smiley, 02 August 2016 - 03:21 PM.

[smiley]

This dip top end is nothing unusual on our sc cars emanta and smiley are trying to get to the bottom of why it's happening

 

We tried to see if it's the temp sensor itself, by using a custom cable with temp sensor usage near the inlet.

No difference. Same cutoff.

We think it's another unaccable safety option.

 

Though, i must say if i do a run, my arse dyno does not agree with what the graph shows. All i feel is the rpm limiter cutting in at 7800, and not the powerr loss near 7k.

 

 

[CHILL Gone DUTCH]

i still thinks its some kind of restriction which needs to be pushed through from the inlet manifold 

 

 

 

 

[TFD]

I've got th same dip, even with 35C IAT. So it's not the timing retard thats killing power. 

Not an SC issue.

Edited by TFD, 02 August 2016 - 06:59 PM.