613 replies to this topic

[coldel]

 

 

The sad thing is, all this love for the NHS, it will be forgotten 6 months after we get back to some semblance of normality and people will get back to moaning about waiting times. The Tories will continue to underfund the NHS and run it on a minimum. No lessons will be learnt. It's a real shame, but it's something I almost expect.

 

 

Im hopeing there will be a public resurgence of opinion that the NHS should be funded far more (including the necessity of increasing income tax by 1% or 2% to do so). Maybe the politicians will be "forced" to fund it better, due to the groundswell of opinion.
 

 

 

I'm hoping so although suspect by this time next year Brexit will be the focus of debate once more and 'that thing last year' will be the last thing politicans want to discuss. I mean lets face it, we have made a complete pigs ear of this, doctors were warning the government to prepare back in Jan and they were told to effectively go away. Now we have the health secretary pleading pity because of a shortage of PPE. Germany have smashed it out the ground, fail to prepare and prepare to fail sounds a perfect addage. 

 

But optimistically, yes I would love the Tories to succumb to the public and properly fund the NHS, Police etc. instead of cutting it all. They can be seen to still be Tories and support a public service industry!

[casino]

Well so much for Corbyn’s prattling on about Boris “selling off the NHS”.
Miserable git managed to slink off into never-heard-of-again land without Laura Doomsberg managing to rub his face in it for talking bollocks. 

 

And as for Doomsberg and Co, I wish there was a way of hearing the experts without having to hear the media speaking at the same time. We sometimes get a call from one of the senior virologists at Imperial while she’s queuing outside Sainsbury’s on a Sat morning. But I can’t bring myself to ask questions as I’m sure she needs to step back from all this for a few minutes each week. 
 

 

[phil.d]

Came across this on another forum and seems to sum it all up .

After weeks of meticulous Covid-19 research the following guidelines have now been firmly established:

1. You MUST NOT leave the house for any reason, but if you have a reason, you can leave the house.

2. Masks are useless at protecting you against the virus, but you may have to wear one because it can save lives, but they may not work. They may be mandatory, or not.

3. Shops should be closed, except those shops that are open.

4. You must not go to work, but you can get another job and go to work.

5. You should not go to the Drs or to the hospital unless you have to go there ... unless you are too ill to go there.

6. This virus can kill people, but don’t be scared of it. It can only kill those people who are vulnerable or those people who are not vulnerable people. It’s possible to contain and control it, sometimes, except for the times it leads to a global disaster.

7. Gloves won't help, but they can still help so wear them sometimes, or not.

8. STAY HOME, but it's important to go out.

9. There is no shortage of groceries in the supermarkets, but there are many things missing. You won’t need extra toilet paper, but you should buy some just in case you need some extra.

10. The virus has no effect on children except those children it effects.

11. Animals are not affected, but there is still a cat that tested positive in Belgium in February when no one had been tested, plus a few tigers here and there.

12. Stay 2 metres away from tigers (see point 11).

13. You will have many symptoms if your get the virus, but you can also get symptoms without getting the virus, get the virus without having any symptoms or be contagious without having symptoms, or be non contagious with symptoms.

14. To help protect yourself you should eat well and exercise, but eat whatever you have on hand as it's better not to go out shopping.

15. It's important to get fresh air but don't go to parks but go for a walk. Don’t sit down, except if you are old, but not for too long or if you are pregnant or if you’re not old or pregnant but need to sit down. If you do sit down don’t eat your picnic.

16. Don’t visit old people, but you have to take care of the old people and bring them food and medication.

17. If you are sick, you can go out when you are better, but anyone else in your household can’t go out when you are better (unless they need to go out).

18. You can get restaurant food delivered to the house. These deliveries are safe. But groceries you bring back to your house have to be decontaminated outside for 24 hours including Pizza.

19. You can't see your older mother or grandmother, but they can take a taxi and meet an older taxi driver.

20. You are safe if you maintain a safe social distance when out, but you can’t go out with friends or strangers at a safe social distance.

21. The virus remains active on different surfaces for two hours ... or four hours... six hours... I mean days, not hours... But it needs a damp environment. Or a cold environment that is warm and dry... in the air, as long as the air is not plastic.

22. Schools are closed so you need to home educate your children, unless you can send them to school because you’re not at home. If you are at home you can home educate your children using various portals and virtual class rooms, unless you have poor internet, or more than one child and only one computer, or you are working from home. Baking cakes can be considered maths, science or art. If you are home educating you can include household chores to be education. If you are home educating you can start drinking at 10am.

23. If you are not home educating children you can also start drinking at 10am.

24. The number of corona related deaths will be announced daily, but we don't know how many people are infected as they are only testing those who are almost dead to find out if that's what they will die of… the people who die of corona who aren’t counted won’t be counted.

25. You should stay in lock down until the virus stops infecting people, but it will only stop infecting people if we all get infected, so it’s important we get infected.

[ICD]

Came across this on another forum and seems to sum it all up .

 

 

Yep.

[Wolfstone]

King Abdullah II of Jordan about the challenges faced by a country with millions of refugees and how Jordan has reacted. Worth a watch / listen given my earlier posts.


https://youtu.be/gggIEbTUN24

[oblomov]

 

. I generally like Laura Kuenssberg political reporting but the second the politician says "I believe the first question is from the BBC's Laura Kuenssberg", I know exactly how it's going to go and I turn off shortly after she's managed "Thank you, Prime Minister/Foreign Secretary/whatever". Yet a few hours later on that stupid podcast thing that replaced Andrew Neil, she's much more reasonable and conciliatory.

 

 It comes to something when the bloke from the LADBible website asks better questions than Laura Kuenssberg castrati courtesan of the BBC.  Daily briefings are a version of Russian Roulette where juniour ministers try to dodge the bullet of being asked awkward questions.  And who comes to the fore, holding the Government to account?  None less than the excrable Piers Moron.

 

His interview with Matt Handcock was worth watching (although annoyingly Moron can't help but interrupt when people are trying to answer). He challenged Handcock  about the Gov's earlier herd immunity policy on which they did a U turn about ten days later.  (Docrtinairian Dom had read up on virology overnight and had immediately become an expert with more knowledge than the WHO on how to handle the pandemic - sit back do,  nothing and let people die).  Anyway Handcock lied and insisted there had been no such strategy, so Moron played a clip of the government’s chief scientific officer from a few weeks earlier, discussing the exact policy Handcock was denying had ever existed. Over blistering breakfast exchanges, Moron hasn't been pulling his punches with questions about PPE shortages, coronavirus testing and a failure to protect the elderly to a succession of flailing ministers.  Good viewing also was his evisceration of the 14 year old Labour shadow care for the elderly or whatever minister.

 

Comes to something when we have to rely on the likes of Moron to hold the Gov to account for its failing and inaction in the early stages of this pandemic.

Edited by oblomov, 19 April 2020 - 06:15 PM.

[oblomov]

So Piers Moron gobshite Morning Britain presenter has been at it again – this time eviscerating the totally talentless Oliver 'Dowdy' Dowden with Good Morning Britain taking over from Radio 4's Today programme as Public Enemy No1. Today needed to be boycotted at all cost or completely shut down because it wouldn't allow ministers to tell any old lie that came to mind. without being challenged. “How many NHS care workers have died?” “Dowden – 43. Moron - “80” - How many care residents have died?” Dowdy - “217”. Moron, “Er, how about 7,500?. And so it went on with Dowdy getting a kicking on everything from his insistence that HM Gov had been brilliantly prepared for the pandemic, the use of misleading selective data and the life threatening decision to allow the Cheltenham festival to go ahead. All we learned was that Dowdy doesn't actually know anything but nevertheless well worth the watch.

 

A Downing Street insider revealed - “What you learn about Boris was he didn’t chair any meetings. He liked his country breaks. He didn’t work weekends. It was like working for an old-fashioned chief executive in a local authority 20 years ago. There was a real sense that he didn’t do urgent crisis planning. It was exactly like people feared he would be.” While Gordon Brown attended every Cobra meeting about Foot and Mouth which was only about animals dying Doris missed meeting after meeting when the threat of Covid19 was in its incipience and urgent action needed taking.

 

In a speech mainly on Brexit in Greenwich on 3 February, Doris attacked Wuhan-style lock downs: “We are starting to hear some bizarre autarkic rhetoric, when barriers are going up, and when there is a risk that new diseases such as coronavirus will trigger a panic and a desire for market segregation.” How wrong can you get considering MI6 was already warning of the dangers in late December. He went on: “Humanity needs some government somewhere that is willing at least to make the case powerfully for freedom of exchange.” He was that government, along with Donald Trump. Herd Immunity was Johnson’s policy until it became politically unsustainable. Thereafter, incompetence.

 

After Operation Cygnus, designed to test the NH ability to deal with a pandemic it was identified that we were seriously short of PPE and respirators. The answer?  A deliberate 40% cut in emergency personal protective equipment stockpiled for an epidemic.

 

[sford]

One of the things I read earlier was someone spouting off about how Germany is heading towards being a dictatorship the way it has run things. However this was handled, it was going to be ridiculed and criticized as being badly done.

 

 

[Zoobeef]

Peak deaths looks to be April the 8th. At just over 800. Given it takes 3 weeks to die, that says that the peak infections were around the 18th, before the "lockdown". Meaning social distancing of the vulnerable was working.

Well done everyone, big pat on your backs for the lockdown.

[jonnyboy]

Peak deaths looks to be April the 8th. At just over 800. Given it takes 3 weeks to die, that says that the peak infections were around the 18th, before the "lockdown". Meaning social distancing of the vulnerable was working.
Well done everyone, big pat on your backs for the lockdown.

That's what the number crunchers on "more or less" said this morning. The numbers the Government are pushing are the ones to make things sound worse but the peak infection rate I think it was 3 days before lockdown? Would that indicate that even mild social distancing worked?

Hindsight is a wonderful thing but could it be that lockdown was completely pointless?

[Zoobeef]

Possibly, but you can see why we did it anyway given the state of the rest of the world.

Boris would have needed Swedish sized balls to not follow suit.

The biggest issue is what happens now, and the lack of info coming from Boris the invisible, apart from his cronies saying we could be like this for a long time yet, and STAY AT HOME, SAVE LIVES, is starting to grate.

About 85% less new cancer cases are being found currently than normal. Either Corona is a cure or its down to the fact they've reduced screening.

 

They estimated an EXTRA 260000-500000 people died from cancer from the 2008 financial crisis (worldwide). Wonder how those numbers are going to look with a financial crisis mixed with a lack of screening.

[casino]

Thought the idea was to see how easing restrictions in other countries effects the figures? 

[jonnyboy]

I think some kind of easing will begin within 2 weeks. Roads are busier. Business are starting to go back. As predicted I'm starting to see local self employed people returning to work (insert going through the motions of PPE/ handwashing) maccy Ds wil hopefully come back soon that will be a watershed moment. Im commencing deliveries of cars soon (never has been against guidelines) we have to find a way to live with this thing. The lockdown will ease if the Government like it or not so might as well try and make it look official.

[casino]

I think some kind of easing will begin within 2 weeks. Roads are busier. Business are starting to go back. As predicted I'm starting to see local self employed people returning to work (insert going through the motions of PPE/ handwashing) maccy Ds wil hopefully come back soon that will be a watershed moment. Im commencing deliveries of cars soon (never has been against guidelines) we have to find a way to live with this thing. The lockdown will ease if the Government like it or not so might as well try and make it look official.

Boris won’t be in a hurry to ease up, after his near death experience I don’t think he’ll lift the lock down anytime soon. 

But how folks manage this is another story. 

[ICD]

Greece reported zero deaths yesterday.

 

They had an early lock curfew style lockdown, heaviliy policed, but also followed and respected by the population, they doubt they will get a second wave. Funny that.

 

The only difference is there economy, alot are cash in hand, the others many are government paid, and the country is still recovering from the crash.

 

Whilst the truth of what is happening in Germany, they are being safety adversed, and the lockdown continues, and is being followed by the majority of the population and being heaviliy policed with due respect to the citizens and they are weeks ahead of us in their testing. Only necessary shops are open, not barbers, jewellers, car dealers etc

 

Whilst France is still laissez faire

 

The UK some where in the middle of the two.

 

A second wave is highly likely if we open up too soon which the UK is working towards, testing and the populus following the instructions on lockdown is key. June 1st earliest date still being planned. Hang in there people.

Edited by ICD, 24 April 2020 - 10:42 AM.

[Ormes]

Greece reported zero deaths yesterday.

 

They had an early lock curfew style lockdown, heaviliy policed, but also followed and respected by the population, they doubt they will get a second wave. Funny that.

 

The only difference is there economy, alot are cash in hand, the others many are government paid, and the country is still recovering from the crash.

 

Whilst the truth of what is happening in Germany, they are being safety adversed, and the lockdown continues, and is being followed by the majority of the population and being heaviliy policed with due respect to the citizens and they are weeks ahead of us in their testing. Only necessary shops are open, not barbers, jewellers, car dealers etc

 

Whilst France is still laissez faire

 

The UK some where in the middle of the two.

 

A second wave is highly likely if we open up too soon which the UK is working towards, testing and the populus following the instructions on lockdown is key. June 1st earliest date still being planned. Hang in there people.

 

Not questioning what is right or wrong, just adding a little balance... South Korea never had a lockdown... just lots and lots of testing and contact tracing with individual isolation where at risk, and now have zero new cases reported.
 

[Zoobeef]

Greece reported zero deaths yesterday.

 

They had an early lock curfew style lockdown, heaviliy policed, but also followed and respected by the population, they doubt they will get a second wave. Funny that.

 

The only difference is there economy, alot are cash in hand, the others many are government paid, and the country is still recovering from the crash.

 

Whilst the truth of what is happening in Germany, they are being safety adversed, and the lockdown continues, and is being followed by the majority of the population and being heaviliy policed with due respect to the citizens and they are weeks ahead of us in their testing. Only necessary shops are open, not barbers, jewellers, car dealers etc

 

Whilst France is still laissez faire

 

The UK some where in the middle of the two.

 

A second wave is highly likely if we open up too soon which the UK is working towards, testing and the populus following the instructions on lockdown is key. June 1st earliest date still being planned. Hang in there people.

 

The country with a huge tourist industry.

If they now aren't every going to open their borders, wheres the money going to come from?

[techieboy]

Ah, good, Labour have commissioned Baroness Lawrence to investigate the effects of COVID-19 on the BAME community (duplicating the investigation already underway). I'm guessing, but pretty confident that the outcome will be that both COVID and the Government are institutionally racist and that we're most definitely not "all in this together". Normal service has resumed.

[Ormes]

Ah, good, Labour have commissioned Baroness Lawrence to investigate the effects of COVID-19 on the BAME community (duplicating the investigation already underway). I'm guessing, but pretty confident that the outcome will be that both COVID and the Government are institutionally racist and that we're most definitely not "all in this together". Normal service has resumed.

 

I know... hardly what we need now is it... going on about how the BAME community don't have the same employment opportunities so become bus drivers (most of whom in my experience are 1st generation immigrants who funnily enough have come to the UK for a better life with absolutely nothing and haven't walking straight into a high flying job.  I know it's not as simple as I make out but then, there is an opportunity to find a big chip and put it on ones shoulder which must be taken I guess.  FFS

[coldel]

Roads are definitely busier, I think people are taking a chance and going out and getting away with it so embolded to keep doing it. Germany did everything right (basically everything we should have done but our incompetent government didn't) and are managing their way out of it. But I do think the population of the UK are definitely 'out and about' a fair bit more than when we initially locked down. I am almost waiting for the next knee jerk decision from the government that is the norm now i.e. stay home stay safe each day until another complete miss gets enough public visibility that they have to make up some other 'plan' to cover themselves for missing it again. Still, at least they aren't advising us to drink bleach yet.